Originally posted by JCSeerupJust a few examples:
Originally posted by EmanuelC16Would you care to elaborate, I don't really see how.
Originally posted by JCSeerupI didn't use Snowie and the rest is not that much off but this is wrong. If you play GTO it doesn't mean your opponent cannot be +EV.
Playing GTO on the river we play a range that can't be exploited, so no matter what his calling range is the best he can do is breakeven, but when his range is either too strong or too weak we profit.
There will be all sorts of situations where people have suboptimal ranges but because they are too strong/tight. Those are still +EV in that situation but are not part of a EV maximizing strategy.
1. You reach that stage with the exact same range and both play it optimally => you split the blinds.
1) False.
2. The non-optimal player arrives there with a very strong range so will always be +EV there but he will fold too much in a previous situation since that is why his river range is too strong.
LE: Probably easier to say it this way: I only bet river with the nuts. Make my bet -EV. smile There will be all sorts of situations where people have suboptimal ranges but because they are too strong/tight. Those are still +EV in that situation but are not part of a EV maximizing strategy.
Originally posted by ItsnevereasyPot AI OTR means we give our opponent 1:2 to call. He needs 33% equity for that call, so our value/bluff ratio should be 66:33 or 2:1 to make his call break even. He has to make a call 50% of the time to make our bet b/e. Btw this works like this only OTR.
2) Our opponent OTR can't have 50/50 value/bluff, usually it's more like 30/70, depends on sizing. Blockers definitely change ranges a little bit, but I guess it works both ways - bettor can block some bluffcatchers as well. Also I'm sure if we model these ranges, we can take blockers into an account.
our opponent bets all in pot
pot sized bet so GTO is 50/50 value/bluff...
I've done the maths and it sometimes makes sense to 3barrel our entire range and our opponent still can't call enough, so poker is far away from solving imo.
Could you give an example? Is it that he CAN'T call enough or WON'T call enough. Why can't he call enough? He cant beat our bluff range???
Originally posted by getdotacomWhat exactly do you mean by just behind almost any range? Cos for 1/2 pot or 2/3 pot we can still call rivers when we are behind vs a range.
Some example : We open BU and SB 3bets us. We defend ~15% by calling (lets assume we even slowplay AA this way). The board runs out 223K9. Then if we want to defend "enough" according to GTO, we will have to call down with something like AT+ on this board, but we can't do it if our opponent 3barrels his entire range. AT is just behind almost any range on runnout like this. ofc we can argue maybe that our preflop 3bet calling range is too wide, but if it's balanced, then our open range is too wide etc. Then we will come with something like 30% BU open range where we can defend against 3barrels on this runnout, but what's the point if our opponent will always fold then ?
Some example : We open BU and SB 3bets us. We defend ~15% by calling (lets assume we even slowplay AA this way). The board runs out 223K9. Then if we want to defend "enough" according to GTO, we will have to call down with something like AT+ on this board, but we can't do it if our opponent 3barrels his entire range. AT is just behind almost any range on runnout like this. ofc we can argue maybe that our preflop 3bet calling range is too wide, but if it's balanced, then our open range is too wide etc. Then we will come with something like 30% BU open range where we can defend against 3barrels on this runnout, but what's the point if our opponent will always fold then ?smile
