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[NL20-NL50] NL50 JJ(mp2), fr

    • TetraQuark
      Joined: 21.05.2008 Posts: 1,521
      PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $0.50 BB (7 handed) - Poker-Stars Hand Converter from

      SB ($80.95)
      BB ($28.35)
      UTG ($58.65)
      MP1 ($52.25)
      Hero (MP2) ($59.50)
      CO ($72.40)
      Button ($47.50)

      Preflop: Hero is MP2 with K:club: , K:heart:
      2 folds, Hero bets $2, CO calls $2, 3 folds

      Flop: ($4.75) 3:diamond: , 4:spade: , 4:club: (2 players)
      Hero bets $2.50, CO calls $2.50

      Turn: ($9.75) 3:spade: (2 players)
      Hero checks, CO bets $6, Hero raises to $15, CO calls $9

      River: ($39.75) J:spade: (2 players)
      Hero checks, CO checks

      Total pot: $39.75 | Rake: $1.95


      Villain is 12/4/3.0 after 121 hands.

      Pf and flop are standard.
      On turn I decided to ch/r cuz I am not sure I can get much more value from his overpairs(which are majority of his range) with a second barrel and he is def aggro enough to try and take it on turn if I give up the initiative.

      Now his call on turn is messed up. Either I am miles behind or he is drawing.
      J :spade: is not the nicest card although it completes only like 6 or eventually 7 (K :spade: Q :spade:) combos that crush me(out of like 19 if we are optimistic and add TT to his turn range - doubt it).

      Problem is I can see only those 7 combos calling turn ch/r. So I decided to c/c river. Is maybe even c/f better?

      Thanks for any suggestions!
  • 6 replies
    • falcone1983
      Joined: 17.05.2009 Posts: 5,420
      I just bet/bet/bet this. It's so hard for you to be beat here, so just let him make the mistake of not folding his worse pockets. How can you put him on a draw after the turn? Flop is as dry as the desert; he really doesn't bet/call the turn w/ 65s.
    • TetraQuark
      Joined: 21.05.2008 Posts: 1,521
      Ok, lets give him range pf. 22-QQ, AJ+

      Lets asume he asumes I c-bet my whole range on flop. This means he is calling almost his entire range too with intention of floating me or smth. So this would mean 33-QQ and AJ+ again.

      I played the turn for reasons stated in 1st post. I mean cmon how many times do you see a 12/4 callin 2nd or 3rd barrel with mid pp.

      Now about the draw part on turn. Which of his pp do you see playing like that except AA(which he is 3b pf, or if tricky pushing them on turn 90% of time) and maybe, but I strongly doubt it, QQ or JJ.

      Now on river JJ spikes, all fd`s complete and I am only left with extracting value from QQ.

      I know silly spot but I like em this way ... I guess :f_eek: :f_confused:
    • falcone1983
      Joined: 17.05.2009 Posts: 5,420
      Ok, so you think:

      - his range is more than 50% pocket pairs
      - he will call his whole range on the flop
      - he will give up his whole range if you bet the turn except for QQ/JJ & 3 FD-combo's
      - you think he will turn all his other pockets into a bluff if you check


      - you expect him to call your check/raise with them.

      That seems like a very specific, and also incongruent, set of assumptions to me.

      If you really think he's float-y enough to bet his overcards (i.e. Ace high) on the turn, then you can just check/call twice. But you'll inevitably lose value vs. his pocket pairs, and most people aren't floaty enough to make up for that.
    • TetraQuark
      Joined: 21.05.2008 Posts: 1,521

      bet/bet/bet line:
      +great value line vs. pp in general
      -calls turn but every overcard that hits river decreases proability of him calling river and for a range of lets say 77-QQ that is a lot of overcards

      +still get value on turn because I am positive his is turning his low sdv hands into a bluff
      +make him pay dearly for his draws
      -if :spade: hits river u are in the dark
      -could fold TT-QQ vs 3rd barrel on river because of heavy action on turn

      Now in general your line rocks simple nothing to add, I agree 100%! But in this specific situation, vs this opponen nitaggrotardo I think my line extracts more info.

      (spoiler; dude showed AsQs, and didn`t bet river!!! guess he was affraid of JJ)
    • falcone1983
      Joined: 17.05.2009 Posts: 5,420
      LOL @ results.

      Ok, so your opponent was a retard who chose to play his hand in the nut worst way possible (or maybe he just time-outed or misclicked, let's hope so for his sake).

      I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree about the turn :) .
    • Kaitz20
      Joined: 02.02.2007 Posts: 27,343
      problem about c/r : not too many 12/4 players would b/c there pp-s, so I think at that case I´d likely just go c/c mode if you check turn
      But against 12/4 going for 3 streets for value, since he would likely call you down with TT seems also fine option and it is hard him to have 3x or 4x, since he is so tight