[NL20-NL50] SH50 rush 22 BvB deep set and action

    • mrxLT
      mrxLT
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.09.2008 Posts: 435
      Full Tilt - $0.50 NL RUSH (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
      Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

      MP: $37.90
      CO: $30.30
      BTN: $50.00
      SB: $153.75
      Hero (BB): $194.10
      UTG: $45.80

      SB posts SB $0.25, Hero posts BB $0.50

      Pre Flop: ($0.75) Hero has 2:diamond: 2:spade:

      fold, fold, fold, fold, SB raises to $1.50, Hero calls $1.00

      Flop: ($3.00, 2 players) J:diamond: 3:diamond: 2:heart:
      SB bets $2.00, Hero raises to $6.00, SB raises to $17.00, Hero calls $11.00

      Turn: ($37.00, 2 players) J:heart:
      SB bets $25.00, Hero calls $25.00

      River: ($87.00, 2 players) 7:diamond:
      SB bets $60.00, Hero calls $60.00

      18/15/3.4 cbet flop 70(23/33) in ~700 hands.
      We had some 3b/4b action but not something special, not war.

      When i got 3beted on this flop i put him on JJ+; 33; maybe AJ and some flush and cobo draws. If i 4b here i would isolate myself against the range that crushes me. Right?
      In the hand i thought that turn J is pretty good card for me, im not affraid of flushes anymore and he gonna give me action with hes Jx hands. Now i think its actually bad card: overpairs and flush draws now slowing down so im against stronger range. He bets. I think he still bets hes overpairs and AJ on the turn to protect against my flush(combo) draws so its ok to call. Right?
      On the river its getting really ugly, flush hits and he still bets. Now i think its a fold.
      Thoughts?
  • 13 replies
    • AninIII
      AninIII
      Bronze
      Joined: 13.07.2008 Posts: 944
      Hi,

      nh! I'd play it the same.
      Because villain can have AJ, KJ or flush himself here.
      Of course, from time to time he has 33 or JJ (very unlikely) but then it's just a cooler.

      What did he have?

      Best regards,
      Anin
    • Kaitz20
      Kaitz20
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.02.2007 Posts: 27,343
      player must really aggro to 3-bet flop with AJ/KJ or overcards. if he also has smt like 45dd then he may also just b/c and try to hit first his hand
      Agree just calling his 3-bet flop, but when turn card comes you can´t really get away your hand, although you´re very often beat there against 33, since JJ now seems quite unlikely.
    • mrxLT
      mrxLT
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.09.2008 Posts: 435
      he showed K :heart: 8 :heart: ...

      Im still thinking about river. If he valuebets rivered flush, what hands im calling? Jx? overpairs? smaller flushes? Would you bet 2/3 of the pot if you where villain? O would you go for small blockbet?
    • Kaitz20
      Kaitz20
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.02.2007 Posts: 27,343
      Originally posted by mrxLT
      he showed K :heart: 8 :heart: ...

      Im still thinking about river. If he valuebets rivered flush, what hands im calling? Jx? overpairs? smaller flushes? Would you bet 2/3 of the pot if you where villain? O would you go for small blockbet?
      With K8 I wouldn´t really play hand that way
      He kind of overthink there. You´re not really calling 3-bet on the flop without strong hand, so you basically has there smt like AJ or flush or set. Only hand that he is trying you to fold is AJ, but even then you might just not fold that. You never has there overpairs or don´t get on the river smt like TT.
      So not really understand your question, you´re calling river flushes, boats and sometimes Jx hand if you have reason to think he is bluffing you and against that range I wouldn´t really bet river, since you´re not folding enough to make bluff profitable. Small blockbet with K high also isn´t really the best play :D
    • mrxLT
      mrxLT
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.09.2008 Posts: 435
      Originally posted by Kaitz20
      Originally posted by mrxLT
      he showed K :heart: 8 :heart: ...

      Im still thinking about river. If he valuebets rivered flush, what hands im calling? Jx? overpairs? smaller flushes? Would you bet 2/3 of the pot if you where villain? O would you go for small blockbet?
      With K8 I wouldn´t really play hand that way
      He kind of overthink there. You´re not really calling 3-bet on the flop without strong hand, so you basically has there smt like AJ or flush or set. Only hand that he is trying you to fold is AJ, but even then you might just not fold that. You never has there overpairs or don´t get on the river smt like TT.
      So not really understand your question, you´re calling river flushes, boats and sometimes Jx hand if you have reason to think he is bluffing you and against that range I wouldn´t really bet river, since you´re not folding enough to make bluff profitable. Small blockbet with K high also isn´t really the best play :D
      My question was, lets say you are villain and you got AdKd. Would you even bet the river and IF you bet, than how much?
      I think when he bet so much on the river hes either has me crushed (33,JJ) or hes bluffing (with some made hand maybe)
      And im not asking about hes play with K8, he was on some kind of monkey tilt obv :)
    • Tim64
      Tim64
      Black
      Joined: 02.11.2008 Posts: 7,574
      nh, I'm not getting away from this. He has AA/KK, Jx or a flush too often.

      As to your question, if he bets turn as semi-bluff with AdKd, he has to bet river too. If he already puts you on 22/33, then he is not semi-bluffing turn since he knows flush outs are no good.

      So he definitely bets river with AdKd, hoping you have Jx.
    • mrxLT
      mrxLT
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.09.2008 Posts: 435
      Originally posted by Tim64
      nh, I'm not getting away from this. He has AA/KK, Jx or a flush too often.

      As to your question, if he bets turn as semi-bluff with AdKd, he has to bet river too. If he already puts you on 22/33, then he is not semi-bluffing turn since he knows flush outs are no good.

      So he definitely bets river with AdKd, hoping you have Jx.
      ty
      its really make sence
    • Kaitz20
      Kaitz20
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.02.2007 Posts: 27,343
      Originally posted by mrxLT
      Originally posted by Kaitz20
      Originally posted by mrxLT
      he showed K :heart: 8 :heart: ...

      Im still thinking about river. If he valuebets rivered flush, what hands im calling? Jx? overpairs? smaller flushes? Would you bet 2/3 of the pot if you where villain? O would you go for small blockbet?
      With K8 I wouldn´t really play hand that way
      He kind of overthink there. You´re not really calling 3-bet on the flop without strong hand, so you basically has there smt like AJ or flush or set. Only hand that he is trying you to fold is AJ, but even then you might just not fold that. You never has there overpairs or don´t get on the river smt like TT.
      So not really understand your question, you´re calling river flushes, boats and sometimes Jx hand if you have reason to think he is bluffing you and against that range I wouldn´t really bet river, since you´re not folding enough to make bluff profitable. Small blockbet with K high also isn´t really the best play :D
      My question was, lets say you are villain and you got AdKd. Would you even bet the river and IF you bet, than how much?
      I think when he bet so much on the river hes either has me crushed (33,JJ) or hes bluffing (with some made hand maybe)
      And im not asking about hes play with K8, he was on some kind of monkey tilt obv :)
      Sure I´d bet river with nut flush, since you can have there lower flushes, Jx that would call me down. His bet size is quite ok for that, don´t think players can get away there flushes or maybe even Jx
    • matusko
      matusko
      Coach
      Coach
      Joined: 05.09.2010 Posts: 5,896
      maybe a stupid question but why is it good here just to call his raise on the flop? why not reraise?
    • Tim64
      Tim64
      Black
      Joined: 02.11.2008 Posts: 7,574
      maybe a stupid question but why is it good here just to call his raise on the flop? why not reraise?


      There are no stupid questions in poker ;)
      Reason is that if you raise on flop, most players only continue with their strong hands - they will fold all their bluffs.

      Like in this hand, villain has K8s. If you raise (3bet) on the flop he just folds and you dont get any more bluff $ from him :)
    • Kaitz20
      Kaitz20
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.02.2007 Posts: 27,343
      Originally posted by matusko
      maybe a stupid question but why is it good here just to call his raise on the flop? why not reraise?
      being 300bb deep if you 4-bet that board then it is very hard him to continue with worse hands and you end up all-in very often against JJ/33 is he 5-bets. Just calling his 3-bet you keep his range wider and at some cases he might easily put a lot of money in the pot drawing dead
    • matusko
      matusko
      Coach
      Coach
      Joined: 05.09.2010 Posts: 5,896
      I thought so but dont we have to protect our hand against hands like AK, AQ of diamonds? a lot of people like to be extrelemy agresive on the flop with theese kind of hands.
    • NightFrostaSS
      NightFrostaSS
      Bronze
      Joined: 25.10.2008 Posts: 5,255
      Originally posted by matusko
      I thought so but dont we have to protect our hand against hands like AK, AQ of diamonds? a lot of people like to be extrelemy agresive on the flop with theese kind of hands.
      Protection in general is overrated imo. In this case there's what, two combos of the hands you mentioned, and by reraising you isolate yourself against range that destroys you and has you drawing to one out for 300bb.

      And fwiw this deep he'd just prob just flat hero's raise w AQdd/AKdd unless he's on monkey tilt.