Prog + Fusion for WaiBoy (et al of course !)

  • 36 replies
    • nibbana
      nibbana
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      and if you enjoyed the Mahavishnu here's another couple of ear fucker's






      More to come as I think of them.
    • Waiboy
      Waiboy
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      [x] Posting in epic thread. :s_thumbsup:
    • nibbana
      nibbana
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      A couple on the jazz side more than rock in fusion.

      Classic Jaco Pastorius on Bass from 1977 with the false harmonics intro :P



      Staying with bassists - one of my favourites (who also played with Joe Zawinul) Linley Marthe @6:57 if you want to go straight to his solo.



      And back on the rock side - it really needs a good listen because the 1st 1:20 is just playing through the 2 sections. Then each instrument solos over the 2 sections - not being a guitarist the fun really starts for me @2:32 with the Keyboard building into @3:48 with the Bass



      Enjoy
    • jbpatzer
      jbpatzer
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      Is prog metal allowed? This from my favourite concept album, Scenes from a Memory (Ha ha. Start another thread!). It's a hugely theatrical bit of nonsense with loads of piano, far too much drumming and some great tunes. One good thing about Dream Theater, apart from their clear demonstration that Americans can't spell, is that if you buy one of their CDs they deliver better value than any other band as they play more notes per second than anyone else. That's good right?



      I'm going to have to set aside some time to listen to all these tracks, and the ones in my blog. I can only really do it in the car at the moment. I used to play bass about 300 years ago (or at least it feels that way) and when I was a student I got roped into playing with a big band (Glenn Miller and all that stuff), and we used to do Birdland by Weather Report. Not sure I sounded much like Jaco though! :f_mad:
    • jbpatzer
      jbpatzer
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      There are some bass players who inspired me to play (Geddy Lee and Mark King), and some who just make you think, shit, that's too hard, can I learn the drums please? Victor Wooten and Steve Bailey have that effect on me. Have you got their 'Bass Extremes' album?

    • nibbana
      nibbana
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      Originally posted by jbpatzer
      Is prog metal allowed?
      ofc

      Originally posted by jbpatzer
      One good thing about Dream Theater, apart from their clear demonstration that Americans can't spell, is that if you buy one of their CDs they deliver better value than any other band as they play more notes per second than anyone else. That's good right?
      Yea lol, that is of course the benchmark ! It's not the mash of notes that puts me off though, symphonic prog with vocals I find hard to get into in general, the lyrics and vocal melodies are usually so ethereal I find it cringeworthy. Prog Metal, the lyrics & vocal melodies don't do it for me, sometimes I just don't see what it adds to the music.

      Originally posted by jbpatzer
      and we used to do Birdland by Weather Report. Not sure I sounded much like Jaco though! :f_mad:
      Yea, it would be hard work to sound like him, I can play portrait of tracy but I've never really tried any of the false harmonics stuff. If you're into that stuff, this guy Hadrien Feraud - Jaco incarnate




      Originally posted by jbpatzer
      There are some bass players who inspired me to play (Geddy Lee and Mark King), and some who just make you think, shit, that's too hard, can I learn the drums please? Victor Wooten and Steve Bailey have that effect on me. Have you got their 'Bass Extremes' album?
      No, I haven't heard that one. I've watched a LOT of wooten vids on youtube though, just mindblowing the control he has over his instrument, rhythmically superior to all I feel, even if the melody occasionally suffers.
    • NightFrostaSS
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      Meh, prog metal is lame because it's not grim and evil, but oh well, need to up my post count anyways.

    • Waiboy
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      I've heard of pitched harmonics, but not false harmonics. What is the technique? I can't tell from listening - which miffs me a bit tbh.

      That Dream Theater track was very theatrical.. I imagine it would be pretty cool to play a piece like that live. I do think some parts of it were a little self indulgent (not that self indulgence is always a bad thing) and didn't add much but I'm a fan of the dynamic shift moving from heavy distortion to a lone piano can provide (Creep / Epic).

      I've never been a huge fan of demonstrations of virtuosity or musicianship for the hell of it, and there aren't large numbers of folks out there that can show off their chops whilst contributing positively to a piece. Some pretty nice examples of those who can ITT IMO. Bring moar please!
    • jbpatzer
      jbpatzer
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      Originally posted by NightFrostaSS
      Meh, prog metal is lame because it's not grim and evil, but oh well, need to up my post count anyways.

      Not enough goat swallowing in this one imo but :f_thumbsup: anyway.
    • jbpatzer
      jbpatzer
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      Originally posted by Waiboy
      I've heard of pitched harmonics, but not false harmonics. What is the technique? I can't tell from listening - which miffs me a bit tbh.
      I think it's where you make a note with a fret in the usual way, but use the thumb of your right hand to set off the harmonic whilst plucking with a finger on your right hand. I suspect nibbana is your man for explaining this though.
    • Waiboy
      Waiboy
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      Originally posted by jbpatzer
      Originally posted by Waiboy
      I've heard of pitched harmonics, but not false harmonics. What is the technique? I can't tell from listening - which miffs me a bit tbh.
      I think it's where you make a note with a fret in the usual way, but use the thumb of your right hand to set off the harmonic whilst plucking with a finger on your right hand. I suspect nibbana is your man for explaining this though.
      Oh, same thing then. Still can't hear it though - I used to have awesome ears. Getting old sucks. :f_mad:
    • nibbana
      nibbana
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      Originally posted by Waiboy
      Originally posted by jbpatzer
      Originally posted by Waiboy
      I've heard of pitched harmonics, but not false harmonics. What is the technique? I can't tell from listening - which miffs me a bit tbh.
      I think it's where you make a note with a fret in the usual way, but use the thumb of your right hand to set off the harmonic whilst plucking with a finger on your right hand. I suspect nibbana is your man for explaining this though.
      Oh, same thing then. Still can't hear it though - I used to have awesome ears. Getting old sucks. :f_mad:
      OK, "pitched" harmonics or pitch/pinch/pinched harmonics, would be the method of plucking the string normally but then catching it (very lightly) immediately afterwards with the thumb. It can give a really squeally metal sound if your going through distortion etc. False harmonics as used in Birdland (@0:19-0:43) you have the thumb resting on the string before you pluck the note as jb already described. Different techniques but they are actually BOTH false harmonics.

      In both cases the harmonic is made with the picking hand whilst fretting as normal, whereas with natural harmonics you divide the string with the fretting hand and pick as normal.

      EDIT - You can also do the same thing by fretting for example with your forefinger and making the harmonic with the little finger of the same hand whilst plucking as normal - see last chord of Portrait of Tracy

    • nibbana
      nibbana
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      Originally posted by Waiboy
      I've never been a huge fan of demonstrations of virtuosity or musicianship for the hell of it, and there aren't large numbers of folks out there that can show off their chops whilst contributing positively to a piece. Some pretty nice examples of those who can ITT IMO. Bring moar please!
      Just made me think of this



      There are video's of the actual footage of the night, but I don't think they do it justice compared to the LP recording of it.
    • Waiboy
      Waiboy
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      Originally posted by nibbana
      False harmonics as used in Birdland (@0:19-0:43) you have the thumb resting on the string before you pluck the note
      Just tried this out and realised those dudes must practice a lot.
    • jbpatzer
      jbpatzer
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      Originally posted by Waiboy
      Originally posted by nibbana
      False harmonics as used in Birdland (@0:19-0:43) you have the thumb resting on the string before you pluck the note
      Just tried this out and realised those dudes must practice a lot.
      So now everybody plays bass? Waiboy+nibbana+jbpatzer perhaps separated at birth?

      This gets 10/10 for silly progishness of the track title.



      Still haven't managed to listen to any of this stuff. Severe domestic disturbances atm. Glad to be at work tbh.
    • nibbana
      nibbana
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      Originally posted by jbpatzer
      This gets 10/10 for silly progishness of the track title.



      Still haven't managed to listen to any of this stuff. Severe domestic disturbances atm. Glad to be at work tbh.
      :f_love: for hyper extended prog titles involving courts, space time, light etc.

      I'm struggling to listen to everything too, though I found myself 5 minutes to give the Wooten/Bailey thing a crack and man am I happy I did ! Could listen to that kind of stuff all day. Hope you are domestically undisturbed sooner rather than later jb, peace.
    • nibbana
      nibbana
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      Just lolz

    • jbpatzer
      jbpatzer
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      When I was 14 I was a nerdy, spotty, maths-obsessed social cripple. I told my friend Alex that Chopin + Beethoven > 'pop' music (I may well have been right there!). He lent me Permanent Waves by Rush, Rising by Rainbow and Heaven and Hell by Black Sabbath. My life changed. I became a nerdy. spotty, maths-obsessed social cripple. with appalling taste in music and unreasonably long hair. Happy days.

      This features Ritchie Blackmore playing too many notes, Cozy Powell hitting his drums too hard and too often, and Ronnie Dio (RIP btw) singing very loudly. It's 8 minutes long, and it was recorded in 1976 and imo must therefore count as prog.

    • nibbana
      nibbana
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      Originally posted by jbpatzer
      When I was 14 I was a nerdy, spotty, maths-obsessed social cripple. I told my friend Alex that Chopin + Beethoven > 'pop' music (I may well have been right there!). He lent me Permanent Waves by Rush, Rising by Rainbow and Heaven and Hell by Black Sabbath. My life changed. I became a nerdy. spotty, maths-obsessed social cripple. with appalling taste in music and unreasonably long hair. Happy days.
      Please write autobiography, it would be a v funny read.

      P.S. Chopin > pop ; Beetoven > Pop ; so Chopin+Beethoven >> Pop, even if you play them simultaneously :D


      Originally posted by jbpatzer
      This features Ritchie Blackmore playing too many notes, Cozy Powell hitting his drums too hard and too often, and Ronnie Dio (RIP btw) singing very loudly. It's 8 minutes long, and it was recorded in 1976 and imo must therefore count as prog.
      The clue is in the font ! I reckon it's rock/metal but given the criteria it does fill I think it can stay ;)
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