Shoving big stacks early game

    • Murn90
      Murn90
      Bronze
      Joined: 23.09.2010 Posts: 71
      Hey guys.
      I would like your opinion on villains who shoves 50-75bb in early game - I see it a lot in stars 180 man turbos. The problem is that the range is very different from villain to vilain, I see some regs shove QQ and KK never seen AA. The problem is what do we call them with?

      Unknown players range: 77-QQ, AQo+, AJs+ - I think this is on the tight side, cause sometimes they shove random hands - your opinion??
      If this is the range we call them with equilater says 99+ and AK if we need 48.5% equity.

      Regs range: JJ-KK, AKo, AQs+ - really haven't seen regs shove wider and they may not shove AQs - your opinion??
      If this is the range we call them with QQ+ and AKs if we need 48.5% equity.

      Hope to get some response to this, cause I see the shoves a lot in micros.
  • 6 replies
    • Tiltberger
      Tiltberger
      Bronze
      Joined: 23.06.2005 Posts: 28,155
      i would call those shoves with reads (that player is shoving really wide)
      with jj+ and aqs+

      i call tighter players with qq+ and ak+

      the good thing is they normally don't have aa, kk because they 3bet it or raise it open instead of shoving.
    • TheRebuz
      TheRebuz
      Platinum
      Joined: 12.10.2008 Posts: 2,078
      Originally posted by seeberger
      i would call those shoves with reads (that player is shoving really wide)
      with jj+ and aqs+

      i call tighter players with qq+ and ak+

      the good thing is they normally don't have aa, kk because they 3bet it or raise it open instead of shoving.
      nope. not true

      TT+,AK should be your calling range

      villains shoving range is 22+,AT+,KQs (good regs shove only KK,AA,AK on 10/20,15/30 from EP to get max value)
    • Tiltberger
      Tiltberger
      Bronze
      Joined: 23.06.2005 Posts: 28,155
      Originally posted by TheRebuz
      Originally posted by seeberger
      i would call those shoves with reads (that player is shoving really wide)
      with jj+ and aqs+

      i call tighter players with qq+ and ak+

      the good thing is they normally don't have aa, kk because they 3bet it or raise it open instead of shoving.
      nope. not true

      TT+,AK should be your calling range

      villains shoving range is 22+,AT+,KQs (good regs shove only KK,AA,AK on 10/20,15/30 from EP to get max value)
      your calling range depends of course on the reads you have. When you know they ship 22+ even 99+ can be +ev call. Or ajs+ (really depends on the range you give the player)

      good regs shove only kk,aa,ak from ep? Good regs shoving kk, aa in first blindlevels from ep? whats good about that?
    • dubadal
      dubadal
      Bronze
      Joined: 05.09.2008 Posts: 263
      TT+, AQs
      you could run into an overpair once in a while, but it's more a question of variance.

      I would advise against calling with AJ/99, since there is also plenty of pushing with JTs+ from late positions and those buggers like catching str8s for some reason...
    • TheRebuz
      TheRebuz
      Platinum
      Joined: 12.10.2008 Posts: 2,078
      Originally posted by Murn90
      Hey guys.
      I would like your opinion on villains who shoves 50-75bb in early game - I see it a lot in stars 180 man turbos.

      Hope to get some response to this, cause I see the shoves a lot in micros.
      @seeberger
      we r talking about 180man turbo micros
      cos people r calling very wide shoves preflop best play to get max value in early levels from EP is to shove QQ+,AK
    • chenny8888
      chenny8888
      Bronze
      Joined: 03.10.2007 Posts: 19,324
      Originally posted by seeberger
      Originally posted by TheRebuz
      Originally posted by seeberger
      i would call those shoves with reads (that player is shoving really wide)
      with jj+ and aqs+

      i call tighter players with qq+ and ak+

      the good thing is they normally don't have aa, kk because they 3bet it or raise it open instead of shoving.
      nope. not true

      TT+,AK should be your calling range

      villains shoving range is 22+,AT+,KQs (good regs shove only KK,AA,AK on 10/20,15/30 from EP to get max value)
      your calling range depends of course on the reads you have. When you know they ship 22+ even 99+ can be +ev call. Or ajs+ (really depends on the range you give the player)

      good regs shove only kk,aa,ak from ep? Good regs shoving kk, aa in first blindlevels from ep? whats good about that?
      value comes from ppl snapcalling shoves with 53o whereas they don't encessarily stack off postflop