4 9th's in 4 Minutes

    • Armovic
      Armovic
      Bronze
      Joined: 20.05.2007 Posts: 13
      Ok. So I tell myself one thing, but do another.

      First hand on Table 1:
      JJ Late position
      MP3 Raised 1/4 of our stacks. I decide to call.
      Flop comes rainbow 278 he goes all in. I'm beating most hands... Likely a maniac here... I call. KK knocks me out in the first hand.

      Table 2: (3 hands in)

      AK offsuit early position. I raise 5BBx. Reraised all in. I KNOW I should fold this early in the SNG.. but I'm playing a turbo where again I've seen people go all in reraising with AJ and AT or low pockets.. is it worth going in on a cointoss? probably not but i call anyways just out of curiosity... I lose to JJ

      Table 3: (hand #9 or so)

      T :heart: T:club: late position with a bunch of limpers. I decide I feel like raising here to 150. BB reraises to 350. I call. flop: 8 :diamond: 9 :diamond: J :heart: .. BB goes all in... Ok.. Open ended... I don't even bother thinking what this guy has, again convincing myself that its a likely maniac move to buy a pot with a couple overs though I feel I'm about to get the boot again.
      I call.. again cause im just itching to find out ... AA I miss my draw.

      First hand on table 4. A :club: Q :diamond:
      MP1 raises to 160 MP3 calls CO calls I call (Button) SB calls.
      Flop: 8 :club: 2 :diamond: T :club:

      Pot was 700.
      MP1 raises 160. MP3 calls. Nice pot odds I decide to call and see the next card, SB folds ... J :club: MP1 bets 100 MP3 Calls. ... hmm.. I smell weakness. and by now the pot is a bit less than my stack. I can call. Or .. I can get stupid and go all in...

      hmm.. ALL IN!. Insta call by MP1 Turns over K :club: K :heart: .. and I bust out in 9th yet again.

      ..
      Ok the good news in all this is, while I was writing this I was playing another SNG I'm the2nd big stack..
      64 BB with a bunch of callers with blinds 200 and 400.. the flop 446 :)
      The turn 6 ! ... and big stack betting at me this whole time... River A.. Value bet got called... It was smooth sailing from there and I ended up first, recovering from the earlier exits.

      But still, I seem to be susceptible to gambling way too early in a SNG.. I know I can't win it early and
      can certainly lose early...

      Oops there I go again Table 6... My JJ just lost to A6... He hit runner runner straight on me .. ugh..Time for a break.

      Any advice guys? I know I don't need to gamble early with these guys on the 5$ - $6 SnG levels early on... but ... I'm having trouble fighting off all in temptations.
  • 7 replies
    • Unam
      Unam
      Moderator
      Moderator
      Joined: 17.08.2006 Posts: 8,999
      hand 1
      You should fold or push before the flop calling is the worst thing you could do here.

      hand 2
      It is not worth going into a coin toss, but you could be way aahead here, so I would most likely call here on the low limits.

      hand 3
      Play 1010 for setvalue here, you won't get all players out of the hand and will very often face an over card on the flop and will have to fold you hand very often.
      150 seems a strange betsize vs many limpers, but I don't know the blind lvls, so it may be OK.
      The guy reraises your raise vs many limpers, give him credit! He doesn't even push all in, or bets high, he wants to lure you in the pot.
      He showed a lot of strength before the flop and does so on the flop give him credit and fold your OESD, you have 8 this isn't a call even without discounting them.

      hand 4
      I fold AQ preflop, the hand sucks in a raised multiway pot.
      On the flop he again wants to lure you in the pot, so be careful!
      On the turn you have at least 15 outs, so why not try to hit one of these? As I said be carful check behind and fold your hand when you do not hit.
      Why bust out on a draw when you can hit it for free?

      As you said yourself don't gamble early and don't think villains are all playing ATC all day.


      Sry when I sound harsh, this isn't my intention, but you asked for help and this is the best way I can give it to you.
    • chenny8888
      chenny8888
      Bronze
      Joined: 03.10.2007 Posts: 19,324
      come on man... delete your all-in button those hands sucked.

      only hand i could possibly have called with was hand 2, and still i would be very wary about doing something like that.

      river bluffing all-ins... i wouldn't do it. then again i bluff quite rarely on the river; only bluffs i would make are to scoop a pot when most likely both of us are playing the board, or i would make a post-oak bluff (a small bet which gives the villain decent pot odds to call which in turn looks like a "pot sweetener" bet hence high fold equity against good players), or i would make a bet if it looked like he was drawing and the last card was a blank. in the case of the post-oak bluff, a failed bet is cheap. otherwise just c/c it down..

      it seems you're playing on tilt? or just really bad play, i'm not sure... maybe take a break and read some poker books etc? i don't know :/.

      i hope that all makes sense
    • brett1985
      brett1985
      Bronze
      Joined: 27.10.2007 Posts: 33
      The way I look at sit and goes I don't play anything but AA/KK/QQ for the first 3 rounds of blinds. With 9 seaters usually 2 -4 people are out by that time and the low blinds mean you still have 90%+ of your starting chips. At this stage you no longer have to beat 8 other people to the 3 paid places but only 5 or so which give you a much better probability of cashing. In my experience you are much more likely to be profitable this way.

      Chris Moneymakers SNG strategy is a good basis for decision making. The way you are playing these hands suggests that you are willing to play marginal hands too strongly.

      You must eliminate marginal hands from your early play and respect the fact that even clueless opponents can be dealt good cards or get lucky.
    • Armovic
      Armovic
      Bronze
      Joined: 20.05.2007 Posts: 13
      Thanks for the solid, honest advice guys.
      Reading some of my notes from yesterday, I was definitely running on fatigue and obvious recklessness, I will fix up these obvious holes in my thought process and work on early discipline.
    • mishh06
      mishh06
      Bronze
      Joined: 14.10.2007 Posts: 126
      I agree with everything Unam said, and i'm not folding AK in a low buy-in turbo.
    • DoigteurFou
      DoigteurFou
      Bronze
      Joined: 16.08.2007 Posts: 1,528
      I don't think gambling early is a good strategy? In the firsts stages, i only stick to the SPT SHC (yeah lol), and limp good SC or pockets for implied odds if unraised pots and at least 2 limpers. You don't need to take risks at the beginning, just play as cheap as possible and take the pot in which you are way ahead your opponents. Hope it makes sense, but that's how i play my s'n'g
    • Unam
      Unam
      Moderator
      Moderator
      Joined: 17.08.2006 Posts: 8,999
      Originally posted by DoigteurFou
      I don't think gambling early is a good strategy? In the firsts stages, i only stick to the SPT SHC (yeah lol), and limp good SC or pockets for implied odds if unraised pots and at least 2 limpers. You don't need to take risks at the beginning, just play as cheap as possible and take the pot in which you are way ahead your opponents. Hope it makes sense, but that's how i play my s'n'g
      The use of the cash game chart isn't totally wrong, but it isn't the best way to play the early stages. PS.com will soon release an SNG beginner guide, with some early charts.

      In general the cash charts are too loose, we want to play very nitty in the beginning of a SNG, because we have no chance to rebuy the chips we have lost.