coaching NL bss to 4 bet or not to 4bet that is the question! | Feedback and Suggestions

- Last post
- First unread post
- grummeler
  
  Bronze
  Joined: 28.05.2006 Posts: 2,237
  - 16.12.2010, 09:16
  - 0
  hello ladies and gentleman
  
  because of my serious illness this topic wasnt coached last month.
  i asked some listeners and a lot of them really wanted that topic to be in a coaching, so here we are.
  
  today will be a theory coaching only, because there is a lot of math included in this topic wether it is profitable or not against a specific opponent (or two) to 4bet or not.
  
  as usual, feel free to post your own hands into this thread.
  - Reply
  - Quote
14 replies
- grummeler
  
  Bronze
  Joined: 28.05.2006 Posts: 2,237
  - 16.12.2010, 09:18
  - 0
  #1
  
  villian is very unknown with only 19 hands, but his 3bet value is 16,7 so far, his agf inf. and his contibet 100%
  4bet/call ? 4bet bluff ? or smoothly call and play in position ?
  
  No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (6 handed) - Hold'em Manager Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com
  
  UTG ($51.42)
  MP ($19.28)
  CO ($26.75)
  Hero (Button) ($25)
  SB ($25.87)
  BB ($47.50)
  
  Preflop: Hero is Button with A , Q
  3 folds, Hero bets $0.75, 1 fold, BB raises $2.10, Hero calls $1.60
  
  Flop: ($4.80) 7 , K , 5 (2 players)
  BB bets $2.35, Hero calls $2.35
  
  Turn: ($9.50) 7 (2 players)
  BB bets $5.35, Hero folds
  
  Total pot: $9.50
  - Reply
  - Quote
- grummeler
  
  Bronze
  Joined: 28.05.2006 Posts: 2,237
  - 16.12.2010, 09:21
  - 0
  #2
  
  this is a question wether to 5bet in blind battle or not
  
  villian: steal smallblind 59%, fold to 3bet 49%, 4bet 18%, AF 1.8, contibet 69%, 344 hands
  
  No-Limit Hold'em, $0.50 BB (4 handed) - Hold'em Manager Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com
  
  SB ($63.60)
  Hero (BB) ($53.60)
  UTG ($52)
  Button ($83.45)
  
  Preflop: Hero is BB with A , A
  2 folds, SB bets $1.25, Hero raises $4, SB raises $12, Hero raises $49.10 (All-In), 1 fold
  
  Total pot: $27
  - Reply
  - Quote
- grummeler
  
  Bronze
  Joined: 28.05.2006 Posts: 2,237
  - 16.12.2010, 09:30
  - 0
  #3
  
  QQ oop, allways difficult to deside wether to 4bet or not
  
  villian (3bet): vpip 20, PFR 18, 3bet 4,5% , AF 4.0, contibet 100%, 69hands
  
  No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (6 handed) - Hold'em Manager Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com
  
  Button ($47.50)
  SB ($27.37)
  BB ($27.72)
  UTG ($25)
  Hero (MP) ($62.28)
  CO ($26.67)
  
  Preflop: Hero is MP with Q , Q
  1 fold, Hero bets $1, 1 fold, Button raises $3.35, 1 fold, BB calls $3.10, Hero calls $2.35
  
  Flop: ($10.15) J , 5 , 5 (3 players)
  BB checks, Hero checks, Button bets $9, 1 fold, Hero calls $9
  
  Turn: ($28.15) 6 (2 players)
  Hero checks, Button bets $21, Hero raises $42, Button calls $14.15 (All-In)
  
  River: ($98.45) Q (2 players, 1 all-in)
  
  Total pot: $98.45
  - Reply
  - Quote
- grummeler
  
  Bronze
  Joined: 28.05.2006 Posts: 2,237
  - 16.12.2010, 16:37
  - 0
  #4
  
  villian: vpip 40 / pfr 28 / 3bet 7.5 / contiflop 47 / AF 4.3 / hands 218
  
  No-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (5 handed) - Hold'em Manager Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com
  
  MP ($25)
  Button ($25)
  SB ($47.13)
  BB ($29.99)
  Hero (UTG) ($28.70)
  
  Preflop: Hero is UTG with J , J
  Hero bets $1, 1 fold, Button calls $1, SB raises $4.65, 3 folds
  
  Total pot: $3.25
  - Reply
  - Quote
- grummeler
  
  Bronze
  Joined: 28.05.2006 Posts: 2,237
  - 16.12.2010, 16:39
  - 0
  #5
  
  villian: vpip 19 / pfr 15 / 3bet 5.8 / conti 63% / AF 6.0 / hands 608
  
  No-Limit Hold'em, $0.05 BB (5 handed) - Hold'em Manager Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com
  
  Button ($4.63)
  Hero (SB) ($9.60)
  BB ($6.98)
  UTG ($5)
  MP ($5.11)
  
  Preflop: Hero is SB with Q , A
  2 folds, Button calls $0.05, Hero bets $0.33, BB raises $1, 2 folds
  
  Total pot: $0.75
  - Reply
  - Quote
- Terminatorchief
  
  Bronze
  Joined: 14.10.2008 Posts: 3,312
  - 16.12.2010, 20:28
  - 0
  hello!
  
  Full Tilt - $0.50 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
  Hand converted by PokerTracker 3
  
  CO: $74.45
  BTN: $50.00
  SB: $73.00
  BB: $78.00
  UTG: $56.95
  Hero (MP): $50.00
  
  SB posts SB $0.25, BB posts BB $0.50
  
  Pre Flop: ($0.75) Hero has 9Spade 9Heart
  
  fold, Hero raises to $1.75, CO raises to $6.00, fold, fold, fold, Hero raises to $14.00, CO calls $8.00
  
  Flop: ($28.75, 2 players) TDiamond ADiamond 4Heart
  Hero checks, CO bets $17.75, fold
  
  v. is playing: 31/23. 3bet: 9%
  v. has been 3betting me a lot. i wanted to 4bet broke here because i thing that v. could go broke with worse hands and because i want to to know that he shouldn´t 3bet me so much. would it be better to just fold? is a call ip possible?
  - Reply
  - Quote
- Terminatorchief
  
  Bronze
  Joined: 14.10.2008 Posts: 3,312
  - 16.12.2010, 20:32
  - 0
  Full Tilt - $0.50 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
  Hand converted by PokerTracker 3
  
  UTG: $56.00
  MP: $59.60
  CO: $50.00
  BTN: $50.00
  Hero (SB): $54.50
  BB: $51.50
  
  Hero posts SB $0.25, BB posts BB $0.50
  
  Pre Flop: ($0.75) Hero has JSpade ASpade
  
  fold, fold, fold, fold, Hero raises to $2.00, BB raises to $5.00, Hero calls $3.00
  
  Flop: ($10.00, 2 players) 6Heart AHeart 3Club
  Hero checks, BB bets $5.50, Hero raises to $17.50, fold
  
  v. is playing 21/19. 3bet. 9%
  what is the best preflop play here? playing oop is ugly but i can´t 4bet broke for value. so i would have to 4bet fold as a bluff. i think the hand is to strong for that. so is the call correct even if we have to play oop?
  - Reply
  - Quote
- Terminatorchief
  
  Bronze
  Joined: 14.10.2008 Posts: 3,312
  - 16.12.2010, 20:34
  - 0
  Full Tilt - $0.50 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 5 players
  Hand converted by PokerTracker 3
  
  UTG: $50.00
  Hero (CO): $92.75
  BTN: $65.90
  SB: $142.20
  BB: $129.45
  
  SB posts SB $0.25, BB posts BB $0.50
  
  Pre Flop: ($0.75) Hero has 9Diamond 9Club
  
  fold, Hero raises to $1.50, BTN raises to $4.00, fold, fold, Hero calls $2.50
  
  Flop: ($8.75, 2 players) TDiamond 6Heart 3Heart
  Hero checks, BTN bets $7.25, Hero calls $7.25
  
  Turn: ($23.25, 2 players) 9Heart
  Hero checks, BTN bets $25.00, Hero raises to $81.50 and is all-in, fold
  
  hero is playing 78/54. 3bet: 39% on the first 50 händs, postlfop very aggressive
  against this maniac i would probably play 4bet broke for 100bb in these positions. but we are a little bit deeper. can i still 4bet broke here?
  - Reply
  - Quote
- MickeyDD
  
  Bronze
  Joined: 10.08.2009 Posts: 31
  - 16.12.2010, 22:10
  - 0
  villain's stats in SB are 23% VPIP, 22% PFR, with 3bet 10% over 800 hands.
  
  Hand converted with online PokerStrategy.com hand converter:
  
  Play hand
  
  $0.1/$0.25 No-Limit Hold'em (8 handed)
  
  Known players:
  
  MP1:
  $9.88
  MP2:
  $24.30
  MP3:
  $22.30
  CO (Hero):
  $31.72
  BU:
  $24.50
  SB:
  $8.62
  BB:
  $25.36
  UTG2:
  $30.29
  
  Preflop: Hero is CO with A, K.
  3 folds, MP3 calls $0.25, Hero raises to $1.00, BU folds, SB calls $0.90, BB raises to $4.50, MP3 folds, Hero raises to $11.00, SB folds, BB raises to $25.61, Hero calls $14.36.
  
  Flop: ($51.97) 3, 2, Q (2 players)
  
  Turn: ($51.97) 9 (2 players)
  
  River: ($51.97) 7 (2 players)
  
  Final Pot: $51.97.
  
  Results follow:
  
  Hero shows high card ace(A K).
  BB shows a pair of aces(A A).
  
  BB wins with a pair of aces(A A).
  - Reply
  - Quote
- MickeyDD
  
  Bronze
  Joined: 10.08.2009 Posts: 31
  - 16.12.2010, 22:14
  - 0
  only 31 hands with the villain. he is 16/6 with no 3bet.
  
  Hand converted with online PokerStrategy.com hand converter:
  
  Play hand
  
  $0.1/$0.25 No-Limit Hold'em (8 handed)
  
  Known players:
  
  CO (Hero):
  $25.00
  BU:
  $24.15
  SB:
  $10.39
  BB:
  $51.40
  UTG2:
  $33.25
  MP1:
  $25.00
  MP2:
  $9.83
  MP3:
  $6.30
  
  Preflop: Hero is CO with K, K.
  UTG2 raises to $0.75, MP1 calls $0.75, MP2 folds, MP3 calls $0.75, Hero raises to $3.50, 3 folds, UTG2 raises to $33.25, MP1 folds, MP3 calls $5.55(All-In), Hero calls $21.50(All-In).
  
  Flop: ($65.65) 7, 4, 7 (3 players)
  
  Turn: ($65.65) J (3 players)
  
  River: ($65.65) 8 (3 players)
  
  Final Pot: $65.65.
  
  Results follow:
  
  Hero shows two pairs, kings and sevens(K K).
  UTG2 shows two pairs, aces and sevens(A A).
  MP3 shows two pairs, sevens and fives(5 5).
  
  UTG2 wins with two pairs, aces and sevens(A A).
  - Reply
  - Quote
- MickeyDD
  
  Bronze
  Joined: 10.08.2009 Posts: 31
  - 16.12.2010, 22:18
  - 0
  - This post has been edited 2 time(s), it was last edited by MickeyDD: 16.12.2010 22:35.
  villain's preflop stats 38/8/4 over 220 hands, with no 3bet in BU.
  
  Hand converted with online PokerStrategy.com hand converter:
  
  Play hand
  
  $0.05/$0.1 No-Limit Hold'em (8 handed)
  
  Known players:
  
  BB:
  $10.00
  UTG2:
  $17.40
  MP1:
  $10.26
  MP2:
  $4.00
  MP3:
  $21.47
  CO (Hero):
  $10.00
  BU:
  $11.23
  SB:
  $11.60
  
  Preflop: Hero is CO with K, A.
  UTG2 folds, MP1 raises to $0.30, 2 folds, Hero raises to $0.80, BU raises to $1.30, 3 folds, Hero raises to $10.00, BU calls $8.70.
  
  Flop: ($20.45) 9, 7, 3 (2 players)
  
  Turn: ($20.45) 6 (2 players)
  
  River: ($20.45) 6 (2 players)
  
  Final Pot: $20.45.
  Results follow:
  
  Hero shows a pair of sixs(K A).
  BU shows two pairs, aces and sixs(A A).
  
  BU wins with two pairs, aces and sixs(A A).
  - Reply
  - Quote
- MickeyDD
  
  Bronze
  Joined: 10.08.2009 Posts: 31
  - 16.12.2010, 22:29
  - 0
  villain pre flop stats 45/26/8 over 140 hands
  
  Hand converted with online PokerStrategy.com hand converter:
  
  Play hand
  
  $0.05/$0.1 No-Limit Hold'em (8 handed)
  
  Known players:
  
  BB:
  $8.70
  UTG2:
  $3.50
  MP1:
  $10.00
  MP2:
  $9.77
  MP3 (Hero):
  $10.00
  CO:
  $15.81
  BU:
  $10.00
  SB:
  $8.25
  
  Preflop: Hero is MP3 with A, Q.
  3 folds, Hero raises to $0.30, 3 folds, BB raises to $0.60, Hero calls $0.30.
  
  Flop: ($1.25) 3, 3, K (2 players)
  BB bets $1.00, Hero folds, BB gets uncalled bet back.
  
  Final Pot: $1.25.
  - Reply
  - Quote
- MickeyDD
  
  Bronze
  Joined: 10.08.2009 Posts: 31
  - 16.12.2010, 22:37
  - 0
  villain is 43/10/9.2 preflop over 200 hands
  
  Hand converted with online PokerStrategy.com hand converter:
  
  Play hand
  
  $0.05/$0.1 No-Limit Hold'em (9 handed)
  
  Known players:
  
  CO:
  $10.00
  BU:
  $32.40
  SB:
  $10.49
  BB:
  $7.33
  UTG1 (Hero):
  $10.00
  UTG2:
  $1.43
  MP1:
  $10.73
  MP2:
  $10.00
  MP3:
  $10.00
  
  Preflop: Hero is UTG1 with A, Q.
  Hero raises to $0.30, 5 folds, BU raises to $0.50, 2 folds, Hero calls $0.20.
  
  Flop: ($1.15) K, 2, 8 (2 players)
  Hero checks, BU bets $0.10, Hero calls $0.10.
  
  Turn: ($1.35) 8 (2 players)
  Hero checks, BU bets $0.60, Hero folds, BU gets uncalled bet back.
  
  Final Pot: $1.35.
  - Reply
  - Quote
- MickeyDD
  
  Bronze
  Joined: 10.08.2009 Posts: 31
  - 16.12.2010, 22:43
  - 0
  MP3 has 67/25/4 over 770 hands
  BB has 38/13/14 only 30 hands.
  
  Hand converted with online PokerStrategy.com hand converter:
  
  Play hand
  
  $0.05/$0.1 No-Limit Hold'em (9 handed)
  
  Known players:
  
  UTG1:
  $9.85
  UTG2:
  $5.37
  MP1:
  $12.47
  MP2:
  $10.00
  MP3:
  $15.22
  CO:
  $10.13
  BU:
  $9.26
  SB (Hero):
  $10.08
  BB:
  $8.98
  
  Preflop: Hero is SB with Q, J.
  4 folds, MP3 calls $0.10, 2 folds, Hero raises to $0.40, BB calls $0.30, MP3 raises to $1.00, Hero calls $0.60, BB calls $0.60.
  
  Flop: ($3) 4, 5, 3 (3 players)
  Hero checks, BB checks, MP3 bets $1.20, Hero folds, BB folds, MP3 gets uncalled bet back.
  
  Final Pot: $3.
  - Reply
  - Quote

Complete these tasks and win iPads, Steam vouchers and more