# flatting 4bets

• Coach
Coach
Joined: 03.08.2009
Hey all,

Just figured I'd post a theoretical hand, and see if you guys have any opinions on flatting 4bets. (specifically 100BB deep)

What range do you generally give people? Is it always bad? Do you ever like to slowplay this way or do you generally balance your ranges by always 5bet or folding?

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100BB stacks 6max folded round to hero on BU.

Dealt to hero (As, Ks)

Hero open-raises to 3BB.

SB folds. BB (villain) raises to 9BB. (Villain has shown propensity to
3bet light)

Hero re-raises to 25BB. (Hero has the intention of calling a
shove i.e value 4bet/call)

Villain calls.

*FLOP* (pot size = 50BB remaining stacks = 75BB SPR = 1.5)

6 2 2 rainbow (no backdoor flush)

Villain shoves allin for 75BB

*******************************************

If you run the numbers hero needs 28% equity to make a call in this spot.

If you assign villain a range of ONLY 88-AA hero has 21.12% equity and cannot correctly call.

IF however you assume villain shoves AA-KK pf and give him the remaining combinations of AK hero now has 29.86% equity against a range of 88-QQ, AKs, AKo and can correctly call.

Would he shove AK here though in the hope hero had missed the flop? If so could he also have other Ax in his flop shoving range here further increasing hero's equity?

Preflop hero was deciding to commit against a 5bet. Should he now fold? Hero's equity against JJ+ on the flop is a mere 18.22%. Yet, would you guys often assume villain's range is MUCH wider than this because flatting a 4bet automatically defines him as bad?

Anyways, just for fun, let me know what you think. Let me know if any of the maths is wrong, I'm not perfect
• 5 replies
• Black
Joined: 20.02.2008
edit: don't know why i post things that could potentially make games tougher for me
• Basic
Joined: 23.11.2010
personally i would call seeing how i wanted it all in anyway or assume a pocket pair and go from there.
• Bronze
Joined: 25.10.2008
tl;dr

flatting 4bets is what all the cool guys do
• Bronze
Joined: 04.05.2009
assuming your a micro player that 8% equity your missing is easily covered by his ax bad bluff maniac range. Id never fold at nl10. consider a fold at nl25 vs nitty winners. Fold vs some nl50 players but since im the button and never get any respect probably call it anyway.

Only time ill ever 4 bet call is super deep or with aa vs a maniac that ships any flop but might not call so need a super read
• Coach
Coach
Joined: 03.08.2009