SuperTurbo first hand UTG pushing range

    • Leito99
      Leito99
      Bronze
      Joined: 27.07.2009 Posts: 754
      what range should you push from UTG in a 9max superturbo?

      my thougths:
      Nash says TT+, AJo, ATs, KTs, KQo, QJs

      but it is expecting out opponents to call us with JJ+, AK but in reality($5-20) nobody is ever folding JJ+ AK but they would often call looser, like AQ would often call, maybe even AJ, and some people overrate pairs a lot and call with an average of 77+ im guessing

      how does this affect our range?

      i think pushing around TT+ AQ+ KJs KQo would be more profitable
      thoughts??
  • 5 replies
    • elekadammate
      elekadammate
      Bronze
      Joined: 14.02.2009 Posts: 5,185
      Hi I am a superturbo regular on midstakes. I thought about it a lot and checked out how the good regulars move. Now i push 88+ AK+.

      KQ KJ is bad because bad players calls often with Ax. rather push 88 99.

      AQ - maybegood, but i never seen it from a top regular.
    • pzhon
      pzhon
      Bronze
      Joined: 17.06.2010 Posts: 1,151
      I would expect players to call a bit wider than they should against an early position raise, and the result is that you should drop some of the weaker semibluffing hands from the Nash pushing range. How much of an adjustment to make may depend on the stake level.

      The Nash equilibrium calculation may punish hands like 99. If everyone will call with TT+ or JJ+, then 99 will not perform well. In practice, many players overvalue hands like 66 and will call. The extra calls may make a hand like 99 profitable.

      It is interesting to look at the ranges of some top winning regs, but do not assume that they play optimally. I'm reminded of a joke: "Two economists are walking down the street. One points out a dollar on the ground. The other says without looking, 'No, if there were money there, someone would have picked it up.' " Sometimes you can be the one to notice that there is something the top regs are not doing that they should. If you see someone call with AJ, does that mean many players call with AJ or was it atypical? It can be hard to tell by remembering hands. Also, if someone folds with AK, you don't get to see that. So, what you might want to do is see how often your early position pushes are called within a large database, but most regs will not take that step.
    • dangermowse
      dangermowse
      Silver
      Joined: 24.10.2010 Posts: 1,185
      Could have sworn I already posted in here. Anyway, a rigid set range of TT/AQs should be applied utg with 10bbs 9 handed in a super turbo. Fold AQo and fold 99.
    • Leito99
      Leito99
      Bronze
      Joined: 27.07.2009 Posts: 754
      Originally posted by dangermowse
      Could have sworn I already posted in here. Anyway, a rigid set range of TT/AQs should be applied utg with 10bbs 9 handed in a super turbo. Fold AQo and fold 99.
      How come?

      If Nash says you can unexploitably push AJo (And A10o in the next position) then I'm sure AQo is not just unexploitable but gives a profit too.
      I know the range you gave is given in Sng Wizard but they assume quite loose calling ranges which aren't the case with most players.

      Maybe that range is optimal on microstakes, up to 5.30 but higher, it doesn't seem right to me.
    • dangermowse
      dangermowse
      Silver
      Joined: 24.10.2010 Posts: 1,185
      Since when does nash say what is unexploitable and what isn't? Anyway that is a range to push with every single calling range set to TT/AQ and not even the highest stakes have every player that tight.