What am i doing wrong?

    • antwerp13
      antwerp13
      Bronze
      Joined: 13.02.2009 Posts: 6
      Hi everyone,

      i ve been playing online poker for about 3 years. In this 3 years i ve made several deposits, in total of about 500 Euro s. I ve played on several pokerrooms, mainly Party, but also on Everest, Bodog, Full Tilt, etc. If I should have a graphic of my results it will probably be almost a straight line with some heights and always some depths wich result in a new deposit.

      I ve read some books, watched online videos, i think i did some effort to understand the game.

      Now, the probleme is offcourse that my bankroll doesn 't grow. I play at the lowest micro stakes, so bankroll management can t be a problem.

      I use Holdem indicator since a few months, and when i look at my statistics for 22210 hands, normally i should be a good player (this is the name that Holdem Indicator gives to me depending on those statistics with an icon of a green moneybag :-(.

      These is the result of 22210 hands:
      VPIP 19
      PFR 4
      3 Bet/F 3/38
      Steal/F 5/78
      AF 2.2
      C Bet/F 77/59
      WSD/W 25/54

      Holdem Indicator: Good Player (Tight, Aggressive, Solid).

      Now, again i have to deposit. So, i m a good player (Tight, Aggressive, Solid) but i don t make any money.

      What am i doing wrong? I read everywhere that i have to play tight at the lower levels, wath i always do.

      I really like the game and it would be great to make some money, but in the last 3 years i wasn t that succesfull.

      Normally i play no limit, there where times that i tried limit games but that didn t worked also. I play cash games, tournaments or SNG s have the same negative result.

      Can someone give me some advise on what i m doing wrong and what to do to improve my game?

      Thanks a lot.
  • 15 replies
    • JonikoP
      JonikoP
      Bronze
      Joined: 15.05.2010 Posts: 600
      Hi Antwerp,

      From your stats, you are playing far too loose and passive pre-flop.

      Pre-flop play is the foundation of your post-flop game so getting it right should be your first step. If you are first to enter the pot you should be raising (rather than limping), and your VPIP and PFR should ideally be no more than 4% apart.

      I'd suggest you read the starting hands chart again, reread the articles on pre-flop play and watch MBML's series of videos on pre-flop play.

      GL!
    • TiciBoy
      TiciBoy
      Bronze
      Joined: 13.01.2010 Posts: 1,235
      well...looks like Holdem Indicator is wrong... :P
      How the hell can you be a tight, agressive, solid player with VPIP/PFR 19/4?? :f_confused:

      I suggest you take your time and read all the articles on this site that are available to you.
    • antwerp13
      antwerp13
      Bronze
      Joined: 13.02.2009 Posts: 6
      Thanks for your answers. I think i have to adjust the standard stat settings in Holdem Indicator. The standard VPIP is set for tight < 24%, loose > 33%. You guys have any suggestions for better stat settings?

      If you learn to play poker you read everything, websites like this, books from Sklansky, Gordon, Harrington, etc. One of the major problems is that these books are not written for the wild, small limits.

      So, i think i have to restart again with the starting charts here and erase everything i ve ever read.
    • gadget51
      gadget51
      Bronze
      Joined: 23.06.2008 Posts: 5,622
      overall I play tight, about 11/8/2.3 and I very very rarely limp. Follow the guidance on here and watch your game transform. GL. :)
    • antwerp13
      antwerp13
      Bronze
      Joined: 13.02.2009 Posts: 6
      Watch my game transform, very well writte,. Thats what i need. Because of this Holdem Indicator result i was confused and started to ask myself what i can change, should i play more loose, extra bluffing, more agressive, etc.

      I just gonna play tight like Pokerstrategy recommends and we ll see in a few weeks/months what the difference will be.
    • Ave27
      Ave27
      Bronze
      Joined: 14.01.2007 Posts: 171
      read the starting hands chart, and don't limp as much, 19 is to loose and 4 is to passive PFR. it lets other hands into the pot when you'd rather be heads-up and your good hands have a higher chance of getting out flopped. which means your not getting value for your strong and are limping blinds away with weak hands. play a little tighter, and raise with the hands you want to enter with. make sure your agressive with your strong hands, bet your strong hands and get value for them.

      once you read the articals and re-check your starting hands chart, watch some of the videos, there are a lot of great ones and they explaine their own thoughts.

      good luck, hope this helpped.
    • Bliausmas
      Bliausmas
      Bronze
      Joined: 11.03.2010 Posts: 741
      Well, lets start with what type of games do you play? Cash or SNG (or MTT), 6 max or 9max, FL or NL?

      Bluffing - forget it at microstakes. You might put in tremendous bluff and get called by T high, which would be enough to beat you. You can bluff against player who knows what is he doing, and most of microstakes players don't know.

      Aggression - yes indeed, you should put more of it (although 2.2 AF is not bad). But that doesn't mean you must go wild now. For example, folding where you should fold, instead of chasing some unlikely draw by calling increases your AF.

      And yeah, the stats 19/4 are really bad, no matter what type of game do you play.
    • antwerp13
      antwerp13
      Bronze
      Joined: 13.02.2009 Posts: 6
      Ok, so there is still some hope for me :-)

      I play cash games, NL 9 max.

      One off my biggest mistakes is probably limping to much, just like everybody answered here. Thats a huge leak that i have to solve. I love to see a cheap flop, but as you wrote it attracts extra competition and players with T high that beat me.

      I ve been playing kinda stupid.
    • Bliausmas
      Bliausmas
      Bronze
      Joined: 11.03.2010 Posts: 741
      Yeah, limping is very big leak. Although it's good to get a multiway pot with certain hands, like low-medium pocket pairs, but generally speaking it's bad because the vast majority of the time you won't hit a monster but will kinda hit the flop (like 2TJ flop when you're holding T9) and that will mostly cause you trouble since you don't have initiative and position. Basically the trick is that if you bet, you win when:
      1. Your opponent folds.
      2. Your opponent calls and you have better hand (most of the time when he just calls and not raises - your hand is good).
      3. Your opponent raises and you know that you're beat (yup, giving up the decent/good hand when you know you're beat - that's pure win).
      If you call, you win:
      1. When your opponent has worse hand than yours (and you never know about that if you're calling, you can just guess and hope).

      And if you're playing 9max cash, 19 vpip is too big. Sticking to stats smth like 11/8 - 12/10 should generate the best results to you. In 6max things preflop are little more tricky, but in 9max you basically call preflop only with 22-JJ. You open raise with a wider range according to your position, call raise only with 22-JJ, and fold to a raise with all other hands (while reraising QQ+ obviously).
    • winzsavana
      winzsavana
      Bronze
      Joined: 13.01.2011 Posts: 50
      Originally posted by Bliausmas
      Yeah, limping is very big leak. Although it's good to get a multiway pot with certain hands, like low-medium pocket pairs, but generally speaking it's bad because the vast majority of the time you won't hit a monster but will kinda hit the flop (like 2TJ flop when you're holding T9) and that will mostly cause you trouble since you don't have initiative and position. Basically the trick is that if you bet, you win when:
      1. Your opponent folds.
      2. Your opponent calls and you have better hand (most of the time when he just calls and not raises - your hand is good).
      3. Your opponent raises and you know that you're beat (yup, giving up the decent/good hand when you know you're beat - that's pure win).
      If you call, you win:
      1. When your opponent has worse hand than yours (and you never know about that if you're calling, you can just guess and hope).

      And if you're playing 9max cash, 19 vpip is too big. Sticking to stats smth like 11/8 - 12/10 should generate the best results to you. In 6max things preflop are little more tricky, but in 9max you basically call preflop only with 22-JJ. You open raise with a wider range according to your position, call raise only with 22-JJ, and fold to a raise with all other hands (while reraising QQ+ obviously).
      :spade: :spade:
    • antwerp13
      antwerp13
      Bronze
      Joined: 13.02.2009 Posts: 6
      Bliausmas thanks for your comment. I printed the SSS and BSS lessons. Started reading today (during working hours :-) I m not gonna play for a week, only study. Next week i m gonna deposit 50 $ and start playing by the rules. The next bracelet is mine :D
    • fuzzyfish
      fuzzyfish
      Bronze
      Joined: 12.01.2010 Posts: 862
      I suggest you choose either BSS or SSS, you can't mix both charts. I recommend BSS.
    • gadget51
      gadget51
      Bronze
      Joined: 23.06.2008 Posts: 5,622
      I would suggest BSS as well. I also recommend posting any tricky situations you come across on here for more experienced players to look at. You will find them very helpful. GL.
    • Bliausmas
      Bliausmas
      Bronze
      Joined: 11.03.2010 Posts: 741
      Yeah, BSS all the way. Best of luck!
    • antwerp13
      antwerp13
      Bronze
      Joined: 13.02.2009 Posts: 6
      Can somebody tell me how the stats of an ideal profile would look like regarding:

      VPIP
      PFR
      3 Bet/F
      Steal/F
      AF
      C Bet/F
      WSD/W

      I can also use your answers to correct the filters on my Holdem Indicator.

      Thanks guys.

      PS: it s great the way you guys answer, in the past i almost never post something here. Should have done this a lot sooner.