[NL2-NL10] MSS NL5 I get 3betted and shove QQ

    • tryhardnoob
      tryhardnoob
      Bronze
      Joined: 01.12.2010 Posts: 1,287
      Known players:
      Position:
      Stack
      Hero:
      $2,07
      BU:
      $5

      0,02/0,05 No-Limit Hold'em (9 handed)
      Hand recorder used for this poker hand: Elephant.Base 0.98 by www.pokerstrategy.com.

      Preflop: Hero is MP3 with Q:heart: , Q:diamond:
      4 folds, Hero raises to $0,15, CO folds, BU raises to $0,45, 2 folds, Hero raises to $2,07 (All-In), BU calls $1,62.

      Flop: ($4,21) A:heart: , 6:diamond: , 4:heart:
      Turn: ($4,21) 5:club:
      River: ($4,21) 7:spade: (2 players)


      Final Pot: $4,21

      Results follow (highlight to see):
      Hero shows (Qh Qd)
      BU shows triss, ess (Ad Ac)

      BU wins with triss, ess (Ad Ac)

      Hi I think the AI range of ppl in NL5 is basically kk+, AK. Occationally some monkey tilt KT. However I can't really figure out if this move will be +EV from me when I shove his 3bet. Cause basically worst hands always fold and better hand always call. I'm therefore thinking it is more +EV to call his 3bet. My question is do you think It's +EV to shove his 3bet.
  • 5 replies
    • burek2000
      burek2000
      Bronze
      Joined: 16.11.2007 Posts: 3,105
      Hey tryhardnoob,

      Well played, standard and by the book. In the charts you can see you should always go all-in with QQ after you raised and there is a raise behind you.

      When you consider whether your move is +EV you have to think of all the hands villain will 3-bet you with and look at your equity against his range. And I'm very sure his 3-bet range consists of way more hands than just KK+. Therefore even if villain calls your shove with KK+ only, you will win enough money to be profitable longterm every time he folds as he already invested 0.45$. And calling a 3-bet OOP will only cause you to lose money longterm, because then villain will be able to play more correct against you from position.

      Maybe what BalugaWhale wrote in Easy game...if villain's range is wide enough to call it OOP, you can also 4-bet for value against that range. And with QQ here this is certainly the case.

      Regards,
      burek2000
    • Tampaloeres81
      Tampaloeres81
      Bronze
      Joined: 08.03.2009 Posts: 1,416
      Hi,

      If you want to calculate it, use the following formula:
      EV = Pot*Foldequity + (1-Foldequity)[(eff.Stack+Deadmoney)*Equity – ((eff.Stack-Blind)*(1-Equity))]

      So if you give him a 3bet range of JJ+, AK (3%) and a 4bet/shove calling range of KK+ (1%) you will get this:
      Pot = 0,67
      eff.stack = 1,92
      deadmoney = 0,67
      Equity = 18%
      Foldequity = 67%

      EV = +0,08

      So here you see it is a shove with QQ+, AK

      T.
    • tryhardnoob
      tryhardnoob
      Bronze
      Joined: 01.12.2010 Posts: 1,287
      Originally posted by Tampaloeres81
      Hi,

      If you want to calculate it, use the following formula:
      EV = Pot*Foldequity + (1-Foldequity)[(eff.Stack+Deadmoney)*Equity – ((eff.Stack-Blind)*(1-Equity))]

      So if you give him a 3bet range of JJ+, AK (3%) and a 4bet/shove calling range of KK+ (1%) you will get this:
      Pot = 0,67
      eff.stack = 1,92
      deadmoney = 0,67
      Equity = 18%
      Foldequity = 67%

      EV = +0,08

      So here you see it is a shove with QQ+, AK

      T.
      Sorry but is there anywhere I can see that equation on paper I did good In math I just dont understand what [] means.
    • Tampaloeres81
      Tampaloeres81
      Bronze
      Joined: 08.03.2009 Posts: 1,416
      Hi,

      [ is the same as ( so far I know :)
    • tryhardnoob
      tryhardnoob
      Bronze
      Joined: 01.12.2010 Posts: 1,287
      Originally posted by Tampaloeres81
      Hi,

      [ is the same as ( so far I know :)
      Yepp i noticed, the confusion lied in thinking it was a intergrale. :P