[NL2-NL10] NL2 SH - QQ on AKx board

    • luizsilveira
      luizsilveira
      Bronze
      Joined: 27.11.2010 Posts: 2,320
      So... keeping the topic of my previous posted hand, I have some showdown value and the board is wet, so the question is: cbet or no cbet?


      Full Tilt - $0.02 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 5 players

      UTG: $2.36
      Hero (CO): $5.36
      BTN: $4.91
      SB: $2.08
      BB: $1.87

      SB posts SB $0.01, BB posts BB $0.02

      Pre Flop: ($0.03) Hero has Q:heart: Q:club:

      UTG raises to $0.07, Hero raises to $0.20, fold, fold, fold, UTG calls $0.13

      Flop: ($0.43, 2 players) A:club: K:spade: 8:club:
      UTG checks, Hero...?

      Cheers!
  • 3 replies
    • veriz
      veriz
      Black
      Joined: 20.07.2008 Posts: 65,504
      Hello luizsilveira,

      I would likely just Check behind and be happy to see even free showdown. Although I might bet the turn depending on the card and maybe even get value from some kind of JJ/TT on river if we Check behind on turn as well.

      Best regards.
    • luizsilveira
      luizsilveira
      Bronze
      Joined: 27.11.2010 Posts: 2,320
      Originally posted by veriz
      Hello luizsilveira,

      I would likely just Check behind and be happy to see even free showdown. Although I might bet the turn depending on the card and maybe even get value from some kind of JJ/TT on river if we Check behind on turn as well.

      Best regards.
      I thought so. Thanks for the answer on both QQ topics. But here is what happened in the hand:


      Full Tilt - $0.02 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 5 players

      UTG: $2.36
      Hero (CO): $5.36
      BTN: $4.91
      SB: $2.08
      BB: $1.87

      SB posts SB $0.01, BB posts BB $0.02

      Pre Flop: ($0.03) Hero has Q:heart: Q:club:

      UTG raises to $0.07, Hero raises to $0.20, fold, fold, fold, UTG calls $0.13

      Flop: ($0.43, 2 players) A:club: K:spade: 8:club:
      UTG checks, Hero checks

      Turn: ($0.43, 2 players) J:club:
      UTG bets $0.28, Hero calls $0.28

      River: ($0.99, 2 players) 7:spade:
      UTG checks, Hero checks

      UTG shows J:heart: J:spade: (Three of a Kind, Jacks) (PreFlop 18%, Flop 8%, Turn 70%)
      Hero mucks Q:heart: Q:club: (One Pair, Queens) (PreFlop 82%, Flop 92%, Turn 30%)
      UTG wins $0.93

      I thought he could very well be bluffing the flush, that's why I called the turn. I would certainly be out of there had he bet again the river. But apparently he was afraid of flush too (checked river), even though I think he would not fold to a bet of mine.

      So... was I just "unlucky"? Because it does seem that betting the flop and getting a fold would have been better of course. With JJ and a flop which hits my range pretty well he might very well have folded.

      Yeah, he wouldn't be folding better, but either it would protect our hand (by the fold) or we would be called by worse.

      The thing is... even checking the flop, I don't see us extracting much value on later streets anyway. If the turn is a blank (no-club rag), would he call the bet with his jacks? I doubt it a bit... what could be put us into to make the call? TT? There is nothing he can beat but a complete pre-flop bluff, so he would either fold the flop, turn or river with that board if not hitting his jack (I think). So... if we are not extracting any further value, isn't it better to bet flop, make him fold and get done with the hand?

      Cheers!
    • veriz
      veriz
      Black
      Joined: 20.07.2008 Posts: 65,504
      That was just unlucky that he hit the J on turn and don't be result oriented and that's all my words. Of course it could be as well possible to be the flop but why do you want to turn your hand into bluff? And from those players on NL2 I still expect to make such dumb Calls on river very likely if they have some kind of TT/JJ.

      But of course it wouldn't be wrong either if you just Bet the flop, that's not the point but the point rather is how we would get value from him in further streets. On somewhat drawy boards I usually tend to CBet it more than on dry boards and as well if there is like only an Ace as overcard.