9max turbo vs normal speed

    • ro1chwvd
      ro1chwvd
      Bronze
      Joined: 25.11.2009 Posts: 122
      I have a dilemma. Actually I have more than one, but this is about sngs.

      Currently playing on Fulltilt, micro 9max normal speed sngs. I have only a coupleof hours every day, traffic has gone down at my playing hours and lately the regular speed ones are getting very very long. Having the need to put more volume to stay ahead of variance I started mixing in turbos. The impression is that at the turbos there are worse/more spewy players, therefore the variance will be higher.

      I don't know if it is ok for my learning process to mix turbos with regular speed ones but i think thats the direction I should be heading.

      My question is, should I ditch the normal speed ones, gain volume, get better at ICM and work only with the turbos?


      :club:
  • 6 replies
    • pzhon
      pzhon
      Bronze
      Joined: 17.06.2010 Posts: 1,151
      Originally posted by ro1chwvd
      The impression is that at the turbos there are worse/more spewy players, therefore the variance will be higher.
      That's not how variance works. The quality of your opponents has very little to do with the variance you see. The main determining factor in the mathematical variance is the prize structure, which is the same for regular speed SNGs, turbos, and super turbos. The standard deviation is about 1.5 buy-ins per tournament. Playing 100 tournaments is about as risky as taking a coin flip for 15 buy-ins. The main determining factors in the downswings you will see (which some people call the variance) are the mathematical variance and your win rate. Bad play by your opponents has almost no effect on the mathematical variance, and increases your win rate. So, if you find bad play, this does not increase your variance. It decreases the size of the downswings you will encounter.


      I don't know if it is ok for my learning process to mix turbos with regular speed ones but i think thats the direction I should be heading.

      My question is, should I ditch the normal speed ones, gain volume, get better at ICM and work only with the turbos?
      You need the ICM for each. You will have different stack depths when you reach the bubble in a regular speed tournament, but you still need to understand just how risk-averse you are supposed to be in both types of SNGs.

      You will have many more 15-20 bb decisions near the bubble in regular SNGs where you have to decide whether to resteal or not, or whether your opponents are restealing too often to try a small raise. In a turbo SNG you are usually in push-fold mode by then, which I think simplifies the decisions and leaves less room to outplay your opponents. In addition, in regular SNGs you spend more time in early levels, and so playing well (not overly tightly or overly loosely) in early levels has more of an impact on your regular speed results. Because of these differences, I have a mild recommendation that you not mix the two while learning. There are more similarities than differences, but you have the alternative of playing more carefully on fewer tables of just one speed at a time.

      What you choose to play is still up to you, your skills, your goals, and your tastes. Some people hate playing regular speed tournaments. Some people beat regular speed tournaments while breaking even in turbos, and dislike the swings they see when they play turbos.
    • ro1chwvd
      ro1chwvd
      Bronze
      Joined: 25.11.2009 Posts: 122
      Thank you for the explanations Pzhon.

      In my case I think it will be wiser to stick to turbos for the time being. I have a higher roi for turbos at the moment but this is not really relevant yet because of the sample size (normal speed ~350 sngs vs turbos ~150 sngs, i only do weekly checks). The most important factor for me is volume: because of the limited daily time-frame available, I have to choose the turbos.

      Before Z-Friday the normal speed sngs were very different, more traffic, more bad players, tourneys ending much sooner... now, I just can't afford to play a sng for that long time. Also I can't massive multitable yet. I do comfortably 3 sngs at once, sometimes 4, but no more.
    • Jafreiteris
      Jafreiteris
      Bronze
      Joined: 21.05.2008 Posts: 283
      i say fuck turbo cuz offen you will bleed out too much without playing a hand. Try playing party poker turbo sng, They reward super tights a lot
    • antstruk
      antstruk
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      Joined: 30.08.2010 Posts: 494
      On average which form ( regular or turbo ) has more bad players.
    • ro1chwvd
      ro1chwvd
      Bronze
      Joined: 25.11.2009 Posts: 122
      I would say turbos have more bad players because the occasional gamblers might prefer shorter, more action oriented games. The normal speed ones are more postflop and patience games.

      Not sure about this though...
    • gp00053
      gp00053
      Bronze
      Joined: 27.12.2010 Posts: 154
      Originally posted by ro1chwvd
      I would say turbos have more bad players because the occasional gamblers might prefer shorter, more action oriented games. The normal speed ones are more postflop and patience games.

      Not sure about this though...
      I agree. I find turbo's have more bad gamblers, more bad players, and my personal favorite; "more bad gamblers and bad players who think they know what they're doing. " The downside to turbo's is more swings. Make sure you have the proper bankroll to compensate and adjust your play for the shorter times between blinds.