[NL2-NL10] NL10 - KK against A on the flop

    • epaga
      epaga
      Bronze
      Joined: 05.03.2005 Posts: 89
      1. Should I have bet the turn? (My guess: yes)
      (In this case....)
      1a. How should I have reacted to a raise? (My guess: fold)
      1b. How should I have reacted to a call, then a bet on the river? (My guess: fold)
      1c. How should I have reacted to a call, then a check on the river? (My guess: check)
      2. But I checked the turn...so should I have bet the river in this situation? (My guess: no)
      2a. If so, how should I have reacted to a raise? (My guess: fold)

      Thanks so much for any pointers!

      Party Poker
      No Limit Holdem Ring game
      Blinds: $0.05/$0.10
      9 players
      Converter

      Pre-flop: (9 players) Hero is MP2 with K:spade: K:club:
      UTG folds, UTG+1 calls, MP1 folds, [color:#cc0000]Hero raises to $0.5[/color], 4 folds, BB calls, UTG+1 folds.

      Flop: A:diamond: 6:diamond: 3:spade: ($1.15, 2 players)
      BB checks, [color:#cc0000]Hero bets $0.7[/color], BB calls.

      Turn: T:spade: ($2.55, 2 players)
      BB checks, Hero checks.

      River: T:diamond: ($2.55, 2 players)
      BB checks, Hero checks.

      Results:
      Final pot: $2.55
  • 11 replies
    • Kaitz20
      Kaitz20
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.02.2007 Posts: 27,343
      I would bet 1$ on that flop. On the river I would bet/fold 1,5$
    • Faye6891
      Faye6891
      Bronze
      Joined: 09.11.2007 Posts: 1,234
      I'd have bet a little bit more on the flop.

      Concerning your questions, I agree with all your guesses but question 2.
      After he checks turn and river, showing a lot of weakness I don't think you're beaten (but you maybe :P ), I'm willing to make a valuebet on the river, I may still be called by smaller PP.
    • epaga
      epaga
      Bronze
      Joined: 05.03.2005 Posts: 89
      Thanks guys!

      Why would you bet more on the flop? I've been trying to keep both continuation bets as well as protection bets at around 3/4 of the pot (OK then it would have been 80 cents :)

      Bet/fold river makes sense, I guess I'm just too scared of flushes when people start calling me down with a two-suited board. Of course, that same fear should have led me to bet the turn, so... ;-)
    • Kaitz20
      Kaitz20
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.02.2007 Posts: 27,343
      On NL 10 it probably isn´t so much difference, but for example on NL 25 SH people see these kinds of bets weakness and would min-raise+ you also have to protect against flush and possible straight draws.
    • Faye6891
      Faye6891
      Bronze
      Joined: 09.11.2007 Posts: 1,234
      Originally posted by epaga
      3/4 of the pot (OK then it would have been 80 cents :)
      Yeah, $0.80 would be OK, maybe even a little bit more... $0.90-$1, you bet $0.70 there, that's less than 2/3 of the pot.

      $0.10-$0.30 more doesn't seen to be a lot, but this is NL10, so it's actually 1-3BB difference. ;)
    • swissmoumout
      swissmoumout
      Bronze
      Joined: 23.02.2007 Posts: 3,385
      Originally posted by Kaitz20
      On the river I would bet/fold 1,5$
      Why bet so small? You'll only get worse hands to fold, and every A, T or flush is calling, right? I guess 1 or 2 small pairs are calling, but I doubt it... wouldn't it be better to just check behind?
      It's what I tend to do on these kinds of boards where I have like 2nd / 3rd pair or the board is dangerous (well there's the occasional bluff, but it's rare). Is it correct, or have I just found a big leak in my game? :D
    • Kaitz20
      Kaitz20
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.02.2007 Posts: 27,343
      Since I checked turn, pp might call also. T, A or flush should bet out on the river. If the player is tricky, check behind is also fine, you can´t stand here even check/min-raise. By betting 1,5$ I don´t bet for bluff, but for value.
    • Cojack123
      Cojack123
      Black
      Joined: 28.08.2006 Posts: 1,569
      dont bet the river

      as sayed by swiss "and every A, T or flush is calling"


      #at epaga
      I agree with all your guesses but i want to point out


      1. Should I have bet the turn? (My guess: yes)
      This really depends how loose this people are calling
      If they have to much Ace/rag in there range your
      raise gets -ev if they are floating with a lot hands
      like small pairs and highcards if is more + eV

      All together it is a very marginal play vs unkown, that will only be
      slightly +ev, if at all.

      And it will push our variance.

      Vs a huge callstation it is +EV but this guy
      must call ~ >65% of all contibets.
    • epaga
      epaga
      Bronze
      Joined: 05.03.2005 Posts: 89
      OK, so Cojack, if I get you right, you'd say my turn check wasn't necessarily wrong, since I personally rather lean a bit more toward pot control (and thereby also less variance) than toward protection.

      I didn't really have clear reads on this guy at this point, it was early at the table and I had no stats. But at this level, I have sent PLENTY of people calling raises with Ace rags, so that's kind of what I was a bit afraid of.

      Since this thread is checked by a judge now, guess what he actually had: 52o.

      Yeah. My thoughts exactly. :rolleyes:
    • SonicXT
      SonicXT
      Bronze
      Joined: 15.06.2007 Posts: 4,736
      Originally posted by Kaitz20
      On NL 10 it probably isn´t so much difference, but for example on NL 25 SH people see these kinds of bets weakness and would min-raise+ you also have to protect against flush and possible straight draws.
      Don't ya even dare to assume the general level of play at NL25 is higher than at NL10.
    • Gungunhana
      Gungunhana
      Bronze
      Joined: 26.02.2007 Posts: 429
      Originally posted by SonicXT
      Originally posted by Kaitz20
      On NL 10 it probably isn´t so much difference, but for example on NL 25 SH people see these kinds of bets weakness and would min-raise+ you also have to protect against flush and possible straight draws.
      Don't ya even dare to assume the general level of play at NL25 is higher than at NL10.
      With you all the way :D :D