Using All-in EV and showdown/non-SD winnings for SNG's in Poker Tracker

    • TrufflePig
      TrufflePig
      Bronze
      Joined: 23.12.2010 Posts: 3
      I've been grinding the $2.25 turbo 9 man STT's on FullTilt for about a month with an ROI of 21.5% over around 600 games. Over my last 200 games I ended up with an ROI of -5.38%, I plotted an all-in EV graph on PT3 but i can't work out what it shows especially the showdown/non-SD winnings. I couldnt find any threads on this and I'd appreciate any information anyone has on the subject.
      I don't want to sound like a micro player moaning about losing a few dollars, I just want to work out if I need to alter my game or if I'm just running bad.

      Here's a copy of my all-in EV, showdown/non-SD winnings, etc. per hand in BB and chips.
      http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k515/jrv_901/225STTchips.png
      http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k515/jrv_901/225STTBB.png
  • 5 replies
    • martoman2k10
      martoman2k10
      Bronze
      Joined: 27.08.2010 Posts: 669
      You need bigger samples son
    • pzhon
      pzhon
      Bronze
      Joined: 17.06.2010 Posts: 1,151
      It sounds like PT3 is not the right tool for analyzing SNGs. Those measures make more sense for cash games than for SNGs, since in SNGs it is your equity (estimated by the ICM) rather than the count of chips which matters.

      Even in cash games, players get confused by the showdown versus nonshowdown winnings. They say, "My showdown winnings are great, but I need to work on my nonshowdown losses which are eating all of my profits." These quantities are intertwined. You can't hold one constant and improve the other. When you make a change in the way you play, this will move bad situations from one category to the other, or good situations from one category to the other. You can easily improve your nonshowdown winnings by moving good situations to this category, and by shifting bad situations to showdown hands, such as by making a hopeless call on the river. These changes can lose a lot of money for you. Instead of concentrating on this essentially useless separation, you should focus on the total winnings, and make the plays which improve your total profit.

      It would be much more useful to break your statistics down by the blind level, by the number of players at the table, by your position, and by your stack size. This might indicate whether you have leaks in the early game or near the bubble, or whether you are not taking advantage of the situation properly when you have the chip lead.
    • TrufflePig
      TrufflePig
      Bronze
      Joined: 23.12.2010 Posts: 3
      Hi, thank you very much for your replies. I understand the sample size is very small and probably isn't a proper indicator of any leaks that I may have, I'm just trying to use all of the tools available to me to analyse my game and hopefully improve.

      Pzhon, thank you for your explanation of showdown/non-SD winnings, I was concerned that I was potentially putting money in the pot and giving up too easily when I missed but it appears that non-showdown losses include any blinds that you fold. You mentioned that ICM is a more appropraite measure of your equity in a SNG than all-in chip EV or BB's, is there any software available that can calculate your all-in ICM equity?
    • pzhon
      pzhon
      Bronze
      Joined: 17.06.2010 Posts: 1,151
      Hold'em Manager's all-in luck adjustment for STTs is done using the ICM. It may be buggy for MTT SNGs, but it seems to work well for 9-player SNGs.
    • TrufflePig
      TrufflePig
      Bronze
      Joined: 23.12.2010 Posts: 3
      I'll look into it, thank you very much for your help