[NL2-NL10] NL5 Rush, IP resteal call.... Bad Idea?

    • DaPhunk
      DaPhunk
      Bronze
      Joined: 01.03.2008 Posts: 2,805
      Full Tilt Poker $5.00 No Limit Hold'em - 9 players
      DeucesCracked Poker Videos Hand History Converter

      UTG+2: $5.63
      MP1: $1.78
      MP2: $4.47
      Hero (CO): $7.03
      BTN: $7.65
      SB: $5.36
      BB: $5.63
      UTG: $10.69
      UTG+1: $9.24

      Pre Flop: ($0.07) Hero is CO with T :heart: J :spade:
      3 folds, MP1 calls $0.05, 1 fold, Hero raises to $0.20, 1 fold, SB raises to $0.35, 2 folds, Hero calls $0.15

      Flop: ($0.80) 7 :spade: 4 :heart: A :club: (2 players)
      SB checks, Hero bets $0.35, SB calls $0.35

      Turn: ($1.50) J :club: (2 players)
      SB checks, Hero bets $0.80, SB raises to $4.66, Hero folds


      I think I was allotting too wide a range for my play against this SB resteal. Agree? Thought I could call and get some practice in 3bet pot style. I thought his line looked like KK QQ JJ or TT, on turn his C/R makes it look like he has JJ or he can do thi with AK as well?
  • 8 replies
    • veriz
      veriz
      Black
      Joined: 20.07.2008 Posts: 65,504
      Hello DaPhunk,

      Preflop: Rather fold the hand here. You just putting yourself into difficult spots postflop if you hit your TP and then trying to go broke with it. You often are against some strong PPs.

      As played
      Postflop: Rather Check it behind on turn with having some showdown value even. He ain't gonna fold worse holdings anyways. And even if you want to bet it then bet it bigger on flop ~$0,55 as I said on some early hands. You basically telling him that you don't have the Ax. :)

      Best regards.
    • Kruppe
      Kruppe
      Black
      Joined: 20.02.2008 Posts: 2,144
      you should only fold preflop if you think you'll play terribly postflop, in which case you shouldn't even have sat down. so call preflop :)

      making a small stab at the flop is fine imo, villain will quite often C/F something.

      but after that, you have to remember that this is microstakes rush. it does look like JJ, maybe AA, AJ, maybe other stuff, but he may well have called without a set
    • veriz
      veriz
      Black
      Joined: 20.07.2008 Posts: 65,504
      Originally posted by Kruppe
      you should only fold preflop if you think you'll play terribly postflop, in which case you shouldn't even have sat down. so call preflop :)
      Huh? Shouldn't even sit down on the tables? How many beginners start with just playing SHC and not playing wide range and folding easily to such plays to avoid postflop mistakes. If you are more comfortable playing postflop and having huge edge on them then sure why not to Call and which I would do as well. But it's not like you always have to Call it here if you don't feel that great with the hand.

      Just horrible thinking that folding is mistake here and shouldn't sit down on tables. I just have seen so many hands which are exactly doing the mistake like Calling with such hands and then when hitting TP they are going crazy, Check/Raising and playing for stacks although don't take into account that they might easily isolate themselves against better hands.
    • Kruppe
      Kruppe
      Black
      Joined: 20.02.2008 Posts: 2,144
      no
    • DaPhunk
      DaPhunk
      Bronze
      Joined: 01.03.2008 Posts: 2,805
      Originally posted by veriz
      Preflop: Rather fold the hand here. You just putting yourself into difficult spots postflop if you hit your TP and then trying to go broke with it. You often are against some strong PPs.
      I WANT to get into difficult spots post-flop :) Better to start learning all this at the low limits than avoid it and become scared when it becomes necessarily to start doing this at the higher limits to avoid becoming exploited.


      Thanks for the input on bet-sizing. I was making it small to try and price myself into a multi-barrel lol, kinda stupid really. I'm in position and might as well just get my FE here on the flop :)


      Edit; By the way, what limits are you playing currently? Up to $1/$2 or just $0.5/1 ?
    • veriz
      veriz
      Black
      Joined: 20.07.2008 Posts: 65,504
      Hopefully you did get me correctly that fold to the min-raise. Isolating is totally fine but just the postflop problem will be more difficult when we are against high overpairs mostly.

      Both, I do play right now more HU, so where I find the action I do play. Ongame has a lot of them on NL100/200 tables running. Although nowadays trying to learn more PLO as well so up to PLO100. Could actually play on higher limits but due the withdrawing and need money for living rather prefer to have a very nitty BRM.
    • Kruppe
      Kruppe
      Black
      Joined: 20.02.2008 Posts: 2,144
      oh, wow, i didn't actually combine the fact that you had JT and the fact that turn was J. makes betting pretty sick

      i think neither of you understood what i said about folding preflop.
      due to pot-odds and position, a fold here is only better than a call IF YOU ARE A FISH. and if you are a fish, you should maybe not be playing in the first place.
      but daphunk isn't a fish. sooooo.............


      and i like stabbing smallish in these spots. it gives you much better pot odds and makes a lot of people think it's a value-bet
    • veriz
      veriz
      Black
      Joined: 20.07.2008 Posts: 65,504
      due to pot-odds and position, a fold here is only better than a call IF YOU ARE A FISH. and if you are a fish, you should maybe not be playing in the first place.

      How can I be fish if I just try to avoid variance and I don't want to put myself into difficult spots. Of course I might play the hand but I am trying to teach the basic steps of poker since it's still Basic NL section, isn't it? Don't know how good are everyone postflop skills or how he is going to play. If for example hits his TP and etc.

      but daphunk isn't a fish. sooooo............

      No doubt on that.

      and i like stabbing smallish in these spots. it gives you much better pot odds and makes a lot of people think it's a value-bet

      You mean min-raising like the SB does? Well, then I don't have much to say, hopefully you are winning a lot money with such a play.

      The reason why I would prefer is this:

             Equity     Win     Tie
      UTG    84.25%  84.06%   0.19% { QQ+ }
      UTG+1  15.75%  15.56%   0.19% { JTo }

      Not a huge chance to win the hand. But rather a chance to loose some money postflop while just Calling too much down with just TP and etc. And trying to Raise where shouldn't and etc.

      Plus of course I am pretty sure you don't even have a plan how you gonna play your hand. What you hoping to hit or what's the opponent min-raising range. Of course I am not saying that always his range will be this and most likely it's possible that in "rush" it's even wider. But there are cases where it might be the hand I posted above and we will have hard time making a lot profit from the Call.

      And I am not saying that we ain't getting good implied odds but rather trying to make it simple and easy play and avoid any further mistakes. If DaPhunk is that secure with his postflop play and can easily lay down TP type of hands then sure why not to play the hand. We even 100BB deep.