whenever i play with my nuts people run.

    • DrDunne
      DrDunne
      Bronze
      Joined: 29.12.2010 Posts: 3,338
      the last few times i flopped the nuts i bet for value 2/3 pot and just got folds. it seems to happen whenever i flop the nuts and i guess im having a bit of trouble getting paid off. should i slow play? the last 2 times were 1)nut full house and 2) nut flush. should i just keep betting for value when this happens or should i "get fancy" and slow play... i may start trying that approach to let them catch up i don't really see any other way of doing it. how do you get paid off with the nuts??
  • 8 replies
    • phathustler
      phathustler
      Bronze
      Joined: 03.01.2011 Posts: 23
      make your decision based on the way they usually behave in that situation on average, and how you can optimally exploit it.

      don't slow play just because you have the nuts. or just because they fold a lot. that's not enough reason.

      maybe they never call except when they have like 3rd-nuts or better, and in those cases they'll go crazy, and you'd maximize your profits by betting your nuts every time. in this case, maybe you can adjust by bluffing more often, but slowplaying would often accomplish nothing and sometimes lose you money in those hands where they go crazy and you'd have made more by betting.

      if you think that slowplaying will do something like make them more likely to over-value their hands or call lightly on later streets, enough to make up for the possibility of missing out on a bet when in those few situations where they happened to flop trips against your full house or something, then do it.

      it sounds like you just want to use trial-and-error to figure out what will work. that might help, but you should think through this away from the table some, and then try to reason it out so you don't have to guess-and-check as much.


      in short, make sure you have a good explanation for how your choice is going to make you more money on average than the other possible choices. so far you haven't included enough information to make a decision. it depends on what you expect in later streets, and what you know about these situations on average.
    • pzhon
      pzhon
      Bronze
      Joined: 17.06.2010 Posts: 1,151
      A common mistake is to believe that your opponents' actions depend too much on what you have. If you have the nuts, you feel you have to be coy and make small bets or slow play to draw your opponents in. However, if you have air you don't bluff because you think your opponents call pot-sized bets with any bluff-catcher like bottom pair. It is possible for either one of these to be right, but not both since they are inconsistent. If you have the nuts and feel you have to bet small to get paid off, that must mean betting close to the pot with air would be a profitable bluff. Would you bluff if you had nothing, or does that seem too dangerous?

      There are times to slow-play. If you have AA and flop quad aces, you might slow-play against most opponents since you have the deck crippled: Your opponents will worry that you have even one ace. If you flop a high set against a set-miner, often slow-play. This gives the set-miner a chance to spike a lower set, or to decide that his pair might be good. If the flop is two-tone, a player with a pocket pair can't have a flush draw.

      You should almost never slow-play if you flop the nut straight, since many players with a pair plus straight draw will pay you off now, but the board could easily get much scarier with a fourth card to the straight.
    • DrDunne
      DrDunne
      Bronze
      Joined: 29.12.2010 Posts: 3,338
      thanks for the insight pzhon phathustler these points were very useful and i'm sure i'll look at these situations differently in future. :)
    • Dippy19
      Dippy19
      Bronze
      Joined: 04.12.2007 Posts: 1,346
      Am I the only one who got a kick out of the title :f_biggrin:
    • DNAwithin
      DNAwithin
      Bronze
      Joined: 24.02.2011 Posts: 32
      Originally posted by Dippy19
      Am I the only one who got a kick out of the title :f_biggrin:
      I actually opened this thread only cuz I was expecting to see a mime or something... Like a video of a juggling squirrel or something... :) I guess pun was not intended and my mind is in the gutter. Move along ppl... no nuts here.
    • DrDunne
      DrDunne
      Bronze
      Joined: 29.12.2010 Posts: 3,338
      a juggling squirrel?! hahaaa dunno about that one.. it had to be done. hope that's enough nuts for you DNAwithin lol
    • funnyclock
      funnyclock
      Bronze
      Joined: 06.06.2011 Posts: 68
      Originally posted by Dippy19
      Am I the only one who got a kick out of the title :f_biggrin:
      LOL that was pretty funny. After seeing your post I scrolled up and re-read the title and choked on my coffee
    • esuohdla
      esuohdla
      Bronze
      Joined: 08.05.2011 Posts: 411
      Other people added most of the points I would have made, though I will say a 2/3rd pot size bet may be a little big. Id go for 1/2 pot unless theres a lot of drawing hands that could create a better hand than mine or unless I decide I have a good reason to slowplay it.