# totally stupid question - 3 bet stats and range

• Bronze
Joined: 15.05.2009
I can't believe it took me this long to figure out I was confused...

When looking at someones stats, say they are...

30 VPIP
20 PFR
10 3bet

Does the 10 3bet stat mean...

- he/she 3 bets 10 percent out of all hands played
- he/she 3 bets 10 percent out of all hands where he is facing a PFR

So, when trying to get a range, does a 10 3bet stat mean...

- top 10% of all hands
- top 10% of his 20% PFR... therefore... top 2%

I am confused...

I wont even begin to tell about my confusion about 4 bet stats!

• 11 replies
• Black
Joined: 21.01.2010
It means top 10% of all hands.

4-bet stat means the frequency of how many times he forbets, eq 10% his 4 betting 1 out of 10 times his being 3bet.

4-bet range is lower like 1.2-3% which is the range of hands his 4betting.

As a general note you shouldn't look at 4-bet stat unless you have at least 2k hands on your opponent since it takes a while to get a 4-bet sample.

Hope that clears it up.
• Bronze
Joined: 15.05.2009
very kind... thanks!
• Bronze
Joined: 11.04.2011
The 3-bet % is how many times he 3-bets the pfr, i.e. what percentage pf times that a 3-bet is possible, that the villain actually 3-bets.

When I saw this thread, and started thinking about it, it totally confused my thinking about range! ha
• Bronze
Joined: 31.12.2010
While we are on the subject of 3 bet stats, how many hands on villian do you guys like to have before using these stats in your game? I tend to start using them once its up to around 50 hands but I know this is really too small a sample to be accurate.

Roo
• Bronze
Joined: 19.05.2011

For example:

NLHE Short Handed.
UTG raise, MP fold, CO 3bet, BU fold, SB fold, BB fold, UTG fold.

I know that UTG "fold to 3bet" stat change now (i.e. +). But how about BU, SB, and BB?
• Bronze
Joined: 15.05.2009
that is a good question patszerdonk...
• Bronze
Joined: 10.02.2009
Originally posted by hackbinder
I can't believe it took me this long to figure out I was confused...

When looking at someones stats, say they are...

30 VPIP
20 PFR
10 3bet

Does the 10 3bet stat mean...

- he/she 3 bets 10 percent out of all hands played
- he/she 3 bets 10 percent out of all hands where he is facing a PFR

It means that he's 3-betting with 10 percent of all hands. You should see also from what positions he does that, it is important.
• Bronze
Joined: 10.02.2009
Originally posted by hackbinder

So, when trying to get a range, does a 10 3bet stat mean...

- top 10% of all hands
- top 10% of his 20% PFR... therefore... top 2%

10% 3 bet doesn't means that he makes 3bets with top 10% of the cards that he plays, if he is a good player he will have a balanced range and he could make this move with both monsters like AA KK and AKs but also 57s 86s etc
• Bronze
Joined: 02.01.2009
most good players will be using composite 3bet ranges against other regulars.
• Bronze
Joined: 15.05.2009
most good players will be using composite 3bet ranges against other regulars.

what do you mean by "composite ranges"?
• Bronze
Joined: 11.04.2011
Originally posted by hackbinder
most good players will be using composite 3bet ranges against other regulars.

what do you mean by "composite ranges"?
Composite usually means it's made up of more than one material to strengthen it, so I'd guess it means not just 3-betting the top of your range, or specific hands parts of the range, because this could be exploited. So I think it means you would want to be dynamic with the hands and range you 3-bet so there is no set pattern to it that can be exploited, like "oh he's 3-bet, he only does this with AA, KK or 67s"