collusion/chip dumping views please

    • noel50
      noel50
      Bronze
      Joined: 05.10.2009 Posts: 105
      I play regularly in a online tourney that have a daily feeder to a weekly final and a weekly final that leads to a monthly final and I saw collusion/chip dumping was in play two players were at it I sent the email below to customer support (have taken out names etc now have got on the phone and am waiting to talk to someone in poker support) I now have the hands history(tx for help in software forum) that I think(know my view) show what I am saying happened but am unsure how to continue (my spelling /grammar sucks but I do the best I can but it is hard for me have office now that fixed a lot of errors sorry it looks bad feedback please tx noel


      Original Message Follows: ------------------------ Tournament id feeder to monthly final watch xxxxx play I think collusion was in play I think he dumped chips to another player xxxx on the bubble( twice I saw board/flop 3k5 and raise and fold to a reraise from xxxxx two hands later after putting in more than half his stack from early position no one does that ) watch all hands on the bubble(I think the blinds where 400/800) it looked very strange to me I hope I am wrong I hate cheating it spoils the game for everybody and I want to play one on one with the same chance as everyone else not against two or more players I will post this on a poker form if I can find and post the hands and get other players views
  • 7 replies
    • evertonroar
      evertonroar
      Bronze
      Joined: 26.06.2009 Posts: 737
      without supplying the hand history i doubt very much that anything will be done. I'm 100% sure collusion does happen but it so hard to prove. Only one have I been really sure (when one huge stack posted the BB on the bubble of a sng and folded to a be that was only a few chips higher than the BB (think it was post 400 and fold to an allin of 408). they were talking in italian (i think) and it was pretty obvious. I sent an email to the poker room about it but never heard back.

      i think poker rooms have an interest in removing these guys but only if there is solid proof and I assume more than one complaint
    • noel50
      noel50
      Bronze
      Joined: 05.10.2009 Posts: 105
      i have the hand historys to show this but to show on a public form with the names of people involved ?
    • NenadNacevic
      NenadNacevic
      Bronze
      Joined: 20.02.2009 Posts: 101
      I had such situation in 6 man SnG on Stars. On the bubble two of them started playing really weird. They made sure both of them had similar stacks at all times. If one got low other one dumped chips his way...

      Anyway, me and the guy who went out 4th saw it and reported them. I didn't have to provide anything, only their names and a day after I get an e-mail that they were banned and that their money will be distributed etc.

      What I like the most was that I got them both out in that game. :f_love:
    • evertonroar
      evertonroar
      Bronze
      Joined: 26.06.2009 Posts: 737
      "i have the hand historys to show this but to show on a public form with the names of people involved ? "

      no i mean to the poker room
    • Steelbrewer
      Steelbrewer
      Silver
      Joined: 22.04.2009 Posts: 580
      Have seen such thing in SnG on stars reported nicknames and tourney ID afterwards and had my 1$ refund couple of weeks later. :s_o:

      If you have doubts a chip dump is taking place you don't need to play detective, just give tournament ID and player nicknames to support and the rest is their job, no need to provide any proof or your opinoins.
    • noel50
      noel50
      Bronze
      Joined: 05.10.2009 Posts: 105
      Dear Mr ,

      We have now received a response fron our poker providers in .

      This is what they have replied:--

      ***************************************
      '' Hi There
      We have investigated this matter & were unable to find any conclusive evidence that the players were colluding or chip dumping. The hands mentioned in the complaint has been reviewed & was found to be non-conclusive.

      The fact that the players were seated at an MTT makes the likelihood of collusion/chip dumping occuring very slim. Reason being that players are seated randomly in MTT's, so it makes pre-meditated collusion/chip dumping extremely difficult & unlikely.

      Should you require any further assistance, kindly re-open this request.
    • noel50
      noel50
      Bronze
      Joined: 05.10.2009 Posts: 105
      I found this email in my junk box so I am sorry for the delay in reply first off this is a steps tourney 8 player got a ticket to a monthly final the 9/bubble got 80 euro approx the player who I say was chip dumping to another player in a weekly tournament was already qualified to play in the monthly final so he was playing again in the weekly final for what? For fun he can’t win the same prize again so he paid 20 euro approx to win nothing or finish in the bubble and win 80 euro or to make sure the player he dumped chips too got into the monthly final (I think so or why did he not post and fold and he would have finished in the bubble)(now the two players in question have already won the main monthly prize worth 1000 euro each if there is only two players involved ) now on to the hands which I have all the hands histories short version 1 hand player a had 7670 chips blinds were 350/700 he was in 5 position player b was in the small blind player a raised to 3500 player b raised to 6650 player a called and folded left himself with 1020 chips no one that plays poker that way puts in more than 70% of his stack will fold his hand(all in to the reraise to player correct play or fold very poor play ) now the fact that player b called a 35000 raise with queen ten off ( no one will do that either if you play poker at all we are at the bubble you play premium hands )and the fact no one have seen player a hole cards


      ***** Hand History for
      Tourney Hand NL Texas Hold'em - Sunday, August 14, 10:02:50 ET 2011
      Table 1k Weekly (Real Money)
      Seat 7 is the button
      Seat 1: ( $10110.00 USD )
      Seat 2: player a ( $7670.00 USD )
      Seat 3: ( $11910.00 USD )
      Seat 4: ( $9865.00 USD )
      Seat 5: ( $9620.00 USD )
      Seat 7: ( $13050.00 USD )
      Seat 8: player b ( $11545.00 USD )
      Seat 9: ( $33370.00 USD )
      Seat 10: ( $7490.00 USD )
      Player b posts ante of [$70.00 USD].
      posts ante of [$70.00 USD].
      posts ante of [$70.00 USD].
      posts ante of [$70.00 USD].
      Player a posts ante of [$70.00 USD].
      posts ante of [$70.00 USD].
      posts ante of [$70.00 USD].
      posts ante of [$70.00 USD].
      101 posts ante of [$70.00 USD].
      Player b posts small blind [$350.00 USD]. posts big blind [$700.00 USD].
      Dealt to [ 4d Ah ]
      folds
      folds
      player a raises [$3500.00 USD]
      folds
      folds
      folds
      folds
      player b raises [$6300.00 USD]
      folds
      player b calls [$3150.00 USD]
      ** Dealing Flop ** [ 3d, Kd, 5h ]
      Player b bets [$4755.00 USD]
      Player a folds
      Player b shows [Qs, Tc ]
      Player b wins $19385.00 USD from main pot

      hand 2 player a got lucky/unlucky and got chips to 5560 (when he won with kj I think and everyone called his short stack all in) blinds 350/700 player a was in under the gun position 3 raised to 3500 player b raised to 7000 in late position player a folded again more than 50% of his stack in play and the same player reraise player b and got the chips no one seen player a hole cards
      ***** Hand History for Game
      Tourney Hand NL Texas Hold'em - Sunday, August 14, 10:04:32 ET 2011
      Table Satellite 1k Weekly (Real Money)
      Seat 9 is the button
      Seat 1: ( $9160.00 USD )
      Seat 2: player a ( $5560.00 USD )
      Seat 3: ( $10960.00 USD )
      Seat 4: ( $9725.00 USD )
      Seat 5: ( $9480.00 USD )
      Seat 7: ( $12910.00 USD )
      Seat 8: player b ( $18575.00 USD )
      Seat 9: ( $31720.00 USD )
      Seat 10: ( $6540.00 USD )
      posts ante of [$70.00 USD].
      posts ante of [$70.00 USD].
      Player a posts ante of [$70.00 USD].
      posts ante of [$70.00 USD].
      posts ante of [$70.00 USD].
      posts ante of [$70.00 USD].
      posts ante of [$70.00 USD].
      Player b posts ante of [$70.00 USD].
      posts ante of [$70.00 USD].
      posts small blind [$350.00 USD].
      posts big blind [$700.00 USD].
      Dealt to [ 9h Jd ]
      Player a raises [$3500.00 USD]
      folds
      folds
      folds
      folds
      player b raises [$7000.00 USD]
      folds
      folds
      folds
      player a folds
      player b wins $12180.00 USD from main pot

      hand 3 player a had 1990 chips left himself with 150 chips and folded to who you say player b no one seen player a hole cards
      ***** Hand History for Game
      Tourney Hand NL Texas Hold'em - Sunday, August 14, 10:05:35 ET 2011
      Table Satellite (Real Money)
      Seat 10 is the button
      Seat 1: ( $8390.00 USD )
      Seat 2: player a ( $1990.00 USD )
      Seat 3: ( $10890.00 USD )
      Seat 4: ( $9655.00 USD )
      Seat 5: ( $9410.00 USD )
      Seat 7: ( $12840.00 USD )
      Seat 8: player b ( $23685.00 USD )
      Seat 9: ( $31650.00 USD )
      Seat 10: ( $6120.00 USD )
      posts ante of [$70.00 USD].
      Player a posts ante of [$70.00 USD].
      posts ante of [$70.00 USD].
      posts ante of [$70.00 USD].
      posts ante of [$70.00 USD].
      posts ante of [$70.00 USD].
      Player b posts ante of [$70.00 USD].
      posts ante of [$70.00 USD].
      posts ante of [$70.00 USD].
      posts small blind [$350.00 USD].
      Player a posts big blind [$700.00 USD].
      Dealt to [ 4s 3s ]
      calls [$700.00 USD]
      folds
      folds
      folds
      player b calls [$700.00 USD]
      folds
      folds
      folds
      player a raises [$1140.00 USD]
      calls [$1140.00 USD]
      player b calls [$1140.00 USD]
      ** Dealing Flop ** [ 3c, 4c, Kh ]
      Player a checks
      checks
      player b checks
      ** Dealing Turn ** [ Qh ]
      Player a checks
      checks
      player b bets [$700.00 USD]
      player a folds
      folds
      player wins $7200.00 USD from main pot
      this is chip dumping/collusion in action it is taking money from all the other player who have sat on the same table with these two or more player in the steps tourney involved in fraud I hope there is a full refund of money to everyone involved tx noel