[NL2-NL10] AT NL2 SH Top Pair

    • padretino
      padretino
      Bronze
      Joined: 07.05.2011 Posts: 52
      • 04.09.2011, 13:06
      • This post has been edited 1 time(s), it was last edited by padretino: 04.09.2011 13:57.
      PartyGaming - $0.02 NL - Holdem - 6 players
      Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

      SB: $1.77
      BB: $1.58
      UTG: $3.07
      MP: $1.08
      CO: $1.25
      Hero (BTN): $2.03

      SB posts SB $0.01, BB posts BB $0.02

      Pre Flop: ($0.03) Hero has A:club: T:diamond:

      UTG calls $0.02, fold, CO calls $0.02, Hero raises to $0.10, SB calls $0.09, fold, UTG calls $0.08, fold

      Flop: ($0.34, 3 players) A:heart: 8:club: 7:club:
      SB bets $0.20, fold, Hero calls $0.20

      Turn: ($0.74, 2 players) J:diamond:
      SB bets $0.50, fold

      my greatest problem here is that i dont know if im ahead with TPMK on the flop.

      I considered raising his donkbet on the flop but since i had Ten kicker i decided just to call and reevaluate on the turn. since he continued betting i think the fold in thaat spot was the better option cos i think id be behind his range on the turn: AQ-A7, 9c8c-6c5c, 88-77

      my greatest doubt is about how to play on that flop
  • 6 replies
    • Jaissica
      Jaissica
      Bronze
      Joined: 10.02.2009 Posts: 1,385
      • 04.09.2011, 13:32
      • This post has been edited 2 time(s), it was last edited by Jaissica: 04.09.2011 13:33.
      It is an ugly spot. I lean towards an info-raise (in spite of our recent headline "killing the info-bet/raise" article) to find out now if the villain has an ace or a set or a draw or is just breaking "the rules" with who knows what.

      By calling you basically commit to playing call-down three streets unless the board gets super ugly. That J doesn't really scare me that much. 9T got there, that's all.

      If you are going to commit to potentially paying 25BBs on the turn and who-knows-what on the river, why not throw them in on the flop and see what happens. At least you will know where you stand rather than calling in the dark, or committing a pile of chips and folding anyway. A donk is rarely followed up by a check on later streets.

      If you aren't going to call down blanks or near-blanks on later streets, just fold to the donk - though that is a very weak thing to do with TPMK.

      All roads seem to lead back to an info raise - raise-fold line - on the flop, and against villains you think are capable of shoving draws it gets even uglier and more marginal - because you should raise-jam.
    • padretino
      padretino
      Bronze
      Joined: 07.05.2011 Posts: 52
      hmmmm i dunno bout the raise. if i raised there i think id be isolating myself against a very tight range that probably id be loosing against dont you think?
    • Jaissica
      Jaissica
      Bronze
      Joined: 10.02.2009 Posts: 1,385
      Definitely, a raise will isolate you against hands that beat you here, but it will also stop you calling down 3 streets against hands that beat you, or calling down multiple streets then folding anyway to hands that beat you.

      Folding would be far to weak, just calling along with intent to fold to any completed draw is horrible, and raising isolates you against stronger hands. Your options all suck :)
    • padretino
      padretino
      Bronze
      Joined: 07.05.2011 Posts: 52
      definitly, AT is a hell of a difficult hand :P especially in bss :s_biggrin:
    • Tosh5457
      Tosh5457
      Bronze
      Joined: 18.01.2008 Posts: 3,062
      Originally posted by Jaissica
      It is an ugly spot. I lean towards an info-raise (in spite of our recent headline "killing the info-bet/raise" article) to find out now if the villain has an ace or a set or a draw or is just breaking "the rules" with who knows what.

      By calling you basically commit to playing call-down three streets unless the board gets super ugly. That J doesn't really scare me that much. 9T got there, that's all.

      If you are going to commit to potentially paying 25BBs on the turn and who-knows-what on the river, why not throw them in on the flop and see what happens. At least you will know where you stand rather than calling in the dark, or committing a pile of chips and folding anyway. A donk is rarely followed up by a check on later streets.

      If you aren't going to call down blanks or near-blanks on later streets, just fold to the donk - though that is a very weak thing to do with TPMK.

      All roads seem to lead back to an info raise - raise-fold line - on the flop, and against villains you think are capable of shoving draws it gets even uglier and more marginal - because you should raise-jam.
      If you raised on the flop, what would you do on a blank turn? If he has a draw, you have to bet on the turn or else his call on the flop was profitable for him. But that will make it a big pot for a TPMK (and even TPTK). If you don't bet you're assuming he doesn't have draws in his range, so that 3bet on the flop just isolated you against better hands.

      I'd call the flop and call the turn. If the river is a blank and he bets again I fold, I doubt many players bluff on 3 streets, and Ax hands don't bet 3 streets either.
    • veriz
      veriz
      Black
      Joined: 20.07.2008 Posts: 65,504
      Hello padretino,

      I don't like the raise at all on flop. We practically just making all the worse to fold and if we get 3bet we will never know where we stand. We practically most of the time will be of course behind but most likely it ain't worth while we ain't doing it for value.

      But as we continue on turn it's really up to the opponent. But practically as we take him rather passive opponent I totally agree with folding be safer. Rarely doubt that he would 2nd barrel with just a draw, so it's the only hope that we are against some weaker Ax, but could he have them? Plus of course even some draws completed like T9.

      Best regards.