How to play set?

    • frankissai
      frankissai
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.10.2011 Posts: 2
      Hey Guys,

      I had pocket jacks preflop and I was playing 5/10, there were two limpers I raised it to 80cents had the big blind and one of the limpers called. flop was all spades 7,J, K all spades I bet out $2.00 and the limper shoves, I tanked and folded was that a bad play? bc I felt like he could only have had A of spade and was drawing? what is the correct play.
  • 8 replies
    • hamid88
      hamid88
      Bronze
      Joined: 16.05.2010 Posts: 19
      Personally, I would've checked and let him bet at it. If the board pairs, then you can get all your money in and if another spades comes out (without board pairing), you can get away from the hand. Although, i don't think calling his shove is a bad play but i could be wrong.

      He most probably had an A of spade with possibly a pair on the board or something like KQ with Q of spades.
    • clandestineAl
      clandestineAl
      Bronze
      Joined: 14.06.2010 Posts: 569
      He could have been playing that way with 77, JK, K7, J7, a flush draw or even have already hit his flush. I think it is less likely that he is drawing though. It fells more like he thinks he has the best hand at the moment and he doesn't want you drawing. So I would put him on 77 or a made flush. 77 you beat and you still have outs to a full house which could beat his flush.
    • awesomeo
      awesomeo
      Bronze
      Joined: 09.11.2009 Posts: 303
      It is important to mention the size of his stack so you can get the best possible advise. However I would personally just call the shove because you are ahead of many hands he shoves with and even if he has flush you still have around 30% equity. If he have full stack of 100 BB you have to pay 8$ to win 20 or you need 40% equity. Therefore you only need to add 77, or A of spades to his range and you have more than enough to call. If he has less than 100 BB stack the call is even easier. And since he limps he is probably a bad player that would somethimes suprise you with his k7 or j7 that he would see as the immortal nuts on any board :)
    • gadget51
      gadget51
      Bronze
      Joined: 23.06.2008 Posts: 5,622
      If I have done this right then I am in agreement with 'awesomeo' here.
      As suggesed by you I gave the range of Ax with A spades. If your guess is close then you are still about 60% favourite.
      Again though, as pointed out earlier by awesomeo, his range will be wider than this making it an even easier call for me.

      And I wouldn't fold to a short stack even if he turned his hand face up and showed the A high flush, but that's just me...fishy. lol

      GL.
    • EuanM
      EuanM
      Bronze
      Joined: 07.05.2011 Posts: 531
      Hey frankissai,


      Firstly, intense laydown. I would have went broke in that spot, everytime.

      Let me see if I can show you why.


      I ran the hand in Equilab using a modified range, where any suited Queen, King or Ace is in his limping range, but modified only to spades.

      Now with only this spades range

      code:
      (AsKs,AsQs,KsQs,AsJs,KsJs,QsJs,AsTs,KsTs,QsTs,As9s,Ks9s,Qs9s,As8s,Ks8s,Qs8s,As7s,Ks7s,Qs7s,As6s,Ks6s,Qs6s,As5s,Ks5s,Qs5s,As4s,Ks4s,Qs4s,As3s,Ks3s,Qs3s,As2s,Ks2s,Qs2s


      You have 34.12% Equity against all the spades Ace, King & Queen high flush draw combos (31) with your trips, which is very reasonable.

      If we modify his range once more to something more inclusive. Let's take out AKs, AQs, as personally, I think he would 3-bet you pre-flop with those. Also including any off-suit Ace,King,Queen, where those cards are spades. So he is drawing to a nut, 2nd nut or 3rd nut flush against your trips, you have:

      61.83% Equity.


      From the BB, you have a good range to open. (88+, AJs+, AQo+)
      Against his MP limping range

      code:
      (KK-22, KsQs, KsJs, QsJs, AsTs, KsTs, QsTs, JsTs, As9s, Ks9s, Qs9s, Ts9s, As8s, Ks8s, Qs8s, 9s8s, As7s, Ks7s, Qs7s, 8s7s, As6s, Ks6s, Qs6s, 7s6s, As5s, Ks5s, Qs5s, As4s, Ks4s, Qs4s, As3s, Ks3s, As2s, AsJd, AsJh, AsJc, AsTd, AsTh, AsTc, As9d, As9h, As9c, As8d, As8h, As8c, As7d, As7h, As7c, As6d, As6h, As6c, As5d, As5h, As5c, As4d, As4h, As4c, As3d, As3h, As3c, KsQd, KsQh, KsQc, KsJd, KsJh, KsJc, KsTd, KsTh, KsTc, Ks9d,)


      Where any suited hand already has a flush, and any unsuited hand has a strong flush draw, as well as some straight flush draws, you even have 70% Equity. This calculation is done with the majority of his range having spades in it, and you still have so much equity. I don't see a fold here against a limper.

      All in all his range is wider if he is limping often & is a weaker player, so you may even have more equity than is shown. In the long run, folding here is -EV against a limper IMO.


      tl;dr: Calling his shove is a good play over a large sample size.

      Check/Call is a better line than the one you took. As mentioned in a previous post, you can get away if another spades comes up & shove your stack in if the board pairs.

      One thing to keep in mind, those ranges used include cards which were dealt on the flop, so his nut flush range is a larger percentage of his combos, although its still a limping range, so quite weak overall.

      If he is a competent player, he could be limping a low suited connector / gapper range, such as

      code:
      9s8s,9s7s,8s7s,8s6s,7s6s,7s5s,6s5s,6s4s,5s4s,5s3s,4s3s,4s2s,3s2s


      but even then, we still have a nice 35% equity if those gappers & connectors are all spades.

      I hope this helps!

      -E
    • bullettooth1
      bullettooth1
      Bronze
      Joined: 13.08.2011 Posts: 34
      i think he already had a made low flush, limp-call pre. alot of people play like this on the lower limits. ive seen it many times, he's coming over the top because he doesnt want his small flush getting beat by ur bigger spade. i think that was a tough lay down i dunno if i couldv layed it down just on the offchance he is drawing with his As. and that i could hit a FH. sometimes you just have to go with your gut.
    • hamid88
      hamid88
      Bronze
      Joined: 16.05.2010 Posts: 19
      ^That might be true but at the lower stakes, people also play like that if they're holding the A of spades.
    • Justin37
      Justin37
      Bronze
      Joined: 25.07.2009 Posts: 445
      if u willing to bet $2 after the flop,
      should be willing to call any reraise.
      So, if u are not willing to go all in after the flop,
      you should have check only n see his reaction. If he goes all in, u just save a lot of $$$.

      your bet big n fold after reraise is a bad move for me. You do have % getting fullhouse or 4 of kinds.

      *Unless this is $5/$10 table, ignore my comment.