Great player runs BAD

    • genNNnious
      genNNnious
      Bronze
      Joined: 13.07.2010 Posts: 43
      Hi everyone,

      I am 20 years old professionally poker player from Slovenia. I usualy don't write on forums and i am not crying for every bad beat, but now i would like represent you my story which started with very ambicious start to running worse than it is even possible.

      I started playing poker 3 years ago when i started playing for a few dollars and in meantime i was watching all poker videos (HSP, EPT, educating videos from online pros). I started playing poker all the time 8-12 hours a day and i belive that i become a great poker player especially in SNG. for first year and half i was winning player but i never respect my bankroll so i always got 20 bad beats streak and i lost all my bankroll. then i make another deposit and another and another. And finally i did some withdraws but i run pretty bad and i did not make a lot of money. But that time this was not so important. For me it was important that i become better and better. I analyse every my move especially when i got bust out of tournament. A year ago i stopped going to college becouse i realized that i become a great poker player. I had a plan that i will make a lot of money playing SNG and then i can go play live tournaments where structure is much better and i will become next Jason Mercier or Eugene Katchalov :)

      I am playing online 8-12 hours every day for the last 2 years (100-200 SNG a day), and for the last 13 months i dont have a winning month, i made only 3 small withdrawals. The problem of that is that i run really bad. Every tournament i go out with 60-90 %. When i am reading this forums when people are writing those bad beats it is really funny becouse they do realize only bad beats and they dont count when they are lucky. But i if i am totally honest without a huge ego i am totally genious against players that i am playing. I become good enough that i dont make mistakes. Well, sometimes of course i do, everybody does, but i definatelly dont do mistake when i risk all my chips (except some cooler situations). A lot of the times they hit to me 2,3 outer... well most of the time. I Would understand if this would be matematicaly, but if i am honest i (for example; KK against 77) i won 40-50 procent of the time) and after around 10000 situacions i would said it is pretty sick. i always lost in some bubble or something.

      I can tell you a million bad beats but i will not cry. The problem is that when i am watching ( EPT, events of online poker on pokerstars TV,..) i can see much worse players winning a millions of dollars and this is really sick. I do expect to win in future myself but i have a long way to go). I thought that i will be already millionaire but i run really but all the time. And now i can not even win money when i am playing double or nothing for 5 dollars. They hit some 2,3 outer every sng i playing. And i dont know what to do anymore.

      A few days ago i had a plan they i will be playing 22 dollars sitngo on ongame and after a month i will take a bonus for rakeback. But i always lose my bankroll and EVRY SNG that i lose it is becouse of bad beat. i understand if i would be playing no turbo tournaments it would be better... But still i dont undersstand how it is possible that i lose every tournament in the most ugly way...

      If someone have some good advice i would be appreciate, and thank yo for reading my crying and boring text :D
  • 52 replies
    • Steelbrewer
      Steelbrewer
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      Joined: 22.04.2009 Posts: 580
      One thing to be said: tl;dr.
    • Maniatrix
      Maniatrix
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      Joined: 01.11.2008 Posts: 674
      one time, ONE TIME!!! - tell me what tl;dr means
    • DannyG13
      DannyG13
      Bronze
      Joined: 28.10.2009 Posts: 1,150
      Advice?

      - Bankroll Management
      - Lose the ego, you're probably not as good as you think you are (meant in the nicest way possible :P )

      If you run as bad as you say, let's see a graph with EV. If you don't have a graph because you don't use HEM, then another piece of advice - use HEM. :D
    • xlesleyx
      xlesleyx
      Bronze
      Joined: 17.05.2011 Posts: 136
      Originally posted by DannyG13
      Advice?

      - Bankroll Management
      - Lose the ego, you're probably not as good as you think you are (meant in the nicest way possible :P )

      If you run as bad as you say, let's see a graph with EV. If you don't have a graph because you don't use HEM, then another piece of advice - use HEM. :D
      Lets see graph :f_biggrin:
    • dogma18
      dogma18
      Bronze
      Joined: 08.12.2009 Posts: 340
      not a winning month in 13 months= a loser....if you are playing 8 hours a day for say 25 days per month and you are losing for 13 months then you arent a winner, face it and join the army or something!
    • Rootbox
      Rootbox
      Bronze
      Joined: 04.10.2009 Posts: 14
      a) you lack concentration (judging by your writing style)
      b) you have a serious addiction and you don't know when/why to stop or even can't stop
      take a break for a month (get outside your four walls) and see what happens
      c)try local live tournaments in casinos if there are any (if you can't beat people there, i would advise you to quit it altogether)

      Just my 2 cents.
    • martinstids
      martinstids
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.01.2010 Posts: 271
      Worst thing in poker is to think you are great player ;)
      Show ur graph and your stats, but im 100% sure you play bad. I suggest you to find your leaks and clean ur play. We can try to analyse ur hands, just throw in some ;)
    • genNNnious
      genNNnious
      Bronze
      Joined: 13.07.2010 Posts: 43
      @DannyG13
      I did not respect bankroll managment in the past. When i was playing mtt i always move up and i came in running bad which is totally normal and i always lost all my bankroll. My plan is that as fast as i can i build a good bankroll so i can play 200, 300, 500 euros tournament where struture is much better than tournaments with 200 or less (15,20 mins blind level) are not enough profitable, becouse i have to pay also a hotel, and i don't have a great chance to win a tournament against an amateour where they are playing loose and agressive.

      About my ego; of course i am not great, but i was saying that against the players i am playing i think i am very good, i analyse my hand always and i think when they call your all in with K,J off suit and hit J on the river when i have A,K is not my fault.

      I dont have any computer program.

      @xlesleyx
      I played in all other rooms all the time, you can not see nothing in graphs. But you can check:
      Ongame: Well..no, genNNnious, genNNnious99,
      Pokerstars: genNNnious, styer500
      full tilt: jANCEK99
      888: genNNnious99
      I have around 14 000 dollars prize money in mtt around 4000 of this is a profit.
      But i probably played only 5 % of the time mtt. The reason is that i can not play 12 tables alll the time becouse it is scheduled tournaments and structure(10, 15 minutes) are not for a player who is waiting for better spots then they are coinflip) I do believe i have edge of most of the players and i am trying to find a better spot but mathematically i do go out with 70, 80 procent hand it is absolutelly normal. And i dont have a bankroll for mtt.

      @dogma18
      I totally understand how you can see from your perspective :) it is sad i know :D If i did not see from my site i would also not believe anyone:) but the important thing is that no matter how you ran you also look how you can improve your game and then you gave yourself a better chance.

      @Rootbox
      Thank you for realistic comment:)
      a,b) i had a lot of problems when i started with my concetration, but when i started multi tabling 9-15 tables had gone away, becouse when i see in SNG all the stacks i know of my hand in which range it is exactly. Of course becouse of multi-tabling you can not play perfectly becouse you can not see all the time how your opponents play but it should be essily profitable becouse the players where i play now (ongame) 5,11,22,54 dollars buy are very bad players. To be honest i hate computer and everyhing with in. But i dont have other chance except go working, which i dont wanna work for 5 euros when playing poker is it more interesting and i can make much more money and i am playing every day for bigger limits and i becoming better and better. ( not last year :) )
      c) Yes i have to build my bankroll so i could play at least 200 euros tournament and i can pay for my room there) I dont wanna play online poker all the time it is really not that funny anymore. But you becoming much more better in online than live. i definatelly in 2 years played more games then Doyle played live.

      @martinstilds
      just for you my last tournament :)
      5 players: early positions calls big blind 200 (his stack 4000), fold, player with 6000 chips called 200, i had small blind (100) to 700 with stack 3200 , BB folds; they both calls flop came 2,5,J; i did go all in becouse i have perfect stack for shove i think it is much more better than continuation bet becouse there are 2 opponents and i definatelly want to go out at least 1 of them becouse pot it is already big. he called me with Q,J off. turn K river J. And this is pretty much how i ran i lost with 91 % chance when i could be chipleader. i did go out almost on the bubble, becouse he called with Q,J off in EP. But the most important thing is that you analyse if you could do anything different if it is possible to play better next time.
    • gxtwo
      gxtwo
      Bronze
      Joined: 15.12.2010 Posts: 1,176
      But what did you have?
    • Tarhonya
      Tarhonya
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      Joined: 18.07.2010 Posts: 694
      Hi,

      Originally posted by genNNnious
      multi tabling 9-15 tables
      Originally posted by genNNnious
      I dont have any computer program.
      It seems to me that you're basically playing only your cards and not your opponents, which you can't afford on any limits higher than micros, in my opinion.

      I think HUD is a necessity in today's online poker, mostly because of multi tabling won't let us concencrate on each opponents individually and there's no way that you could do that even with 4-tabling when you're playing that many hours a day as you do.

      I think you lack of discipline maybe because of your ego. You should come up with a BRM plan and stick with it and stop beaing so result-oriented that you want to get to a limit no matter what.

      Recording your sessions and watch them later or even share with the community can be realyl helpful as well.

      These are the thoughts comes to mind, only wrote it to help you, didn't mean to offend you in any way if I did.
    • genNNnious
      genNNnious
      Bronze
      Joined: 13.07.2010 Posts: 43
      Oh i had qq sorry. I already write and then i delete becouse i want to write in the ending and then i forgot :D D


      Hi Tarhonya.

      I definately agree.
      but i am playing only turbo where are important stacks and then you go all in preflop.
      With HUD i would definately play better and i am intending to buy it i just dont know a lot about this things and i dont know how to use it.
      what i am trying to say it is that i lose when i have for instance 70 procent chance of winning i lose like 70 % of the time. and this is really sick. but nothing i can do.
      Like i said it is important that i improve my game..

      Do you have any idea which HUD would be the most impropriate for me and if it maybe for free some trial

      Thank you
    • MathhNes
      MathhNes
      Bronze
      Joined: 24.08.2009 Posts: 953
      If you always lose to bad beats you are likely to be not as good as you think or bad at SNGs. Since you are supposed to be pushing edges according to ICM you will very often be left with the worst hand when called, but due to fold equity it is +$EV and ofc. very +cEV. I'm not a SNG player no more, but that much i do understand of SNG and tournament play.

      Also running that bad for that large of a volume is impossible. Face it. You can probably get better. Maybe you just need to increase your game a little here and there to breakthrough as a long term winner. Face it you have to beat the games quite significant in order to beat the rake

      All of this is meant in a nice way to help you out realising that you may not be as good as you think you are. Read it like a pro would and consider what i said, or read it with absolute disregard to what i'm saying. That is ofcourse up to you. Good luck with finding your way to the millions, it's not easy and requires more than playing 10 hours everyday (by that i mean study away from the tables too, and prob. get a real life as well so you don't end up being too affected by how your life=poker is going)
    • Tarhonya
      Tarhonya
      Bronze
      Joined: 18.07.2010 Posts: 694
      I personally prefer PokerTracker 3, it has a 60 day trial period but there's also Elephant (free) or Holdem Manager (trial) and it can be helpful in push or fold too, giving an idea about opponents preflop calling and raising ranges. Also you can compare your profit with the expected profit, giving you an idea if you are indeed having a bad beat or not.

      I believe there's at least one video about HUD's, but mostly I think watching some sng gameplay videos where HUD is being used can help you understand the stats easily.

      As for variance goes, you can't really do anything about it except for not thinking about it, as I'm sure you know.

      Dunno if reducing table numbers to 4-6 would kill the fun for you or you would get bored too easily, but you should try going for ROI instead of quantity.

      Hope it helps.
    • genNNnious
      genNNnious
      Bronze
      Joined: 13.07.2010 Posts: 43
      Thank you both very much
    • pavels4444
      pavels4444
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      Joined: 09.09.2010 Posts: 1,539
      get a free trial of either HEM or PT3 and show us the EV line. I bet it is not that bad. 13 months is such a long time especially with your volume that i doubt it is only running bad.

      Nowadays, taking poker seriously and not playing with a software is just insane. It is the greatest investment you can do. And you will see for yourself how bad you run or not
    • riotas
      riotas
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      Joined: 01.09.2010 Posts: 10
      Poker is a lot like sex. Everybody thinks they are great at it, but most people don't really know what they're doing.
    • fuzzyfish
      fuzzyfish
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      Joined: 12.01.2010 Posts: 862
      Originally posted by Maniatrix
      one time, ONE TIME!!! - tell me what tl;dr means
      Youl find your answer from the following website ;)

      http://justfuckinggoogleit.com/
    • furculision
      furculision
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      Joined: 25.03.2011 Posts: 474
      genious is underrated imo
    • NeilSimpson
      NeilSimpson
      Bronze
      Joined: 14.06.2010 Posts: 123
      Wow, this post kinda irritated me, if you average 10 hours a day for 13 months, and don't have a winning month, you are a bad player, you are not running bad. Too much volume to blame variance. Uve most likely got it in behind on many occasions and the standard amount of suckouts you get u use as a scapegoat. If u analyse your play, put the volume in and take it that seriously and still can't win, I'm sorry sir, poker just isn't for you!