# All In EV

• Bronze
Joined: 19.05.2011

Hero play 100 hands vs Villain. They go AI everytime/every hand and Hero always has 80% odds every hand. How is hero "AI EV or net expected won" graph compared to "amount won" graph if they AI:

a. preflop
b. on the flop
c. on the turn
d. on the river

On every conditions above (a, b, c, and d) Hero win 80 hands and lose 20 hands.

-----

a. The graphs will be follow different path but both line will be meet at the end.
b. AI EV graph will be above "amount won" at the end
c. AI EV graph will be above "amount won" at the end
d. The graphs will be equal.

I hope my question is clear enough. Thanks.
• 9 replies
• Bronze
Joined: 03.12.2008
If odds are 80/20 and hero win 80/20 of course EV graph and net amount won is in the same spot.

Preflop, flop, turn, doesn't make the difference. Odds are calculated when players go all in.

After river there is also a showdown and you cannot be lucky or unlucky since there is no next card.

And another example. You go all in and odds are 80 20.

You win this hand and earn 100....for this reason EV All in is adjusted for -20.

If you loose it is adjusted for +80.

If i am wrong i hope someone will correct me )
• Bronze
Joined: 19.05.2011
Thanks Alan. I think that's right. At first I thought about it but somehow I can not accepted it as the right answer

OK, I'm clear about a) and d). But I'm still unsure about b) and c).
How if preflop and flop bet valuees are different? At some hands (not all) they 3bet preflop or raise flop. Is this affected to the graph (i.e the graphs do not meet at the end) ?
• Bronze
Joined: 03.12.2008
I think its not....because you always have to go all in and the calculation starts there.

EV means expected value and it is just a statistical one. At the moment you go all in the odds are calculated.

Now here is an example: both player stacks are 100

PF: Hero bet 100 Villian call 100. If you have odds 80/20 and you win your EV will be adjusted by -20

PF: Hero bet 30 Villian call30
Flop: Hero bet 50 Villian call 50
Turn. Hero go all in with 20 Villian call20.....now if you have in this point odds to win 80/20 we have the same situation.....your EV is adjusted by -20

Because at the and you win or you loose the same amount. You just have to calculate the odds just after both players go all in.

I hope i am not much wrong again )
• Coach
Coach
Joined: 19.11.2010
Hi Guys,

The EV is calculated from when both players go all in.

So for ex, I have AA v 44 full stacked at 100nl and we get it aipf, he is around 20%.

If I win the hand my ev will show me as +20 I.E I'm winning 20\$ more than I should be

If I lose the hand my ev will show me as -80 I.E I'm losing 80\$ more than I should be.

Now imagine that I made it \$99 pre flop and the guy called and we go all in after the a48 flop.

My ev if I lose here will be around -4 or swhatever the exact number is, but if I win it will be +96 or whatever as it only counts your percentage to win the hand ONCE YOU ARE ALL IN .
• Bronze
Joined: 24.08.2009
Originally posted by pleno1
Hi Guys,

The EV is calculated from when both players go all in.

So for ex, I have AA v 44 full stacked at 100nl and we get it aipf, he is around 20%.

If I win the hand my ev will show me as +20 I.E I'm winning 20\$ more than I should be

If I lose the hand my ev will show me as -80 I.E I'm losing 80\$ more than I should be.

Now imagine that I made it \$99 pre flop and the guy called and we go all in after the a48 flop.

My ev if I lose here will be around -4 or swhatever the exact number is, but if I win it will be +96 or whatever as it only counts your percentage to win the hand ONCE YOU ARE ALL IN .
Wrong... 20% of 200bb pot is 40bb. So if you win you are 40bb above EV and not 20.
• Coach
Coach
Joined: 19.11.2010
yeh sorry x2 for everything was just trying to show that all in ev occurs after the final cent has gone into the pot.
• Bronze
Joined: 19.05.2011
Originally posted by patszerdonk
Thanks Alan. I think that's right. At first I thought about it but somehow I can not accepted it as the right answer

OK, I'm clear about a) and d). But I'm still unsure about b) and c).
How if preflop and flop bet valuees are different? At some hands (not all) they 3bet preflop or raise flop. Is this affected to the graph (i.e the graphs do not meet at the end) ?
So the answer for my question above is: no, the graphs could be NOT MEET at the end?
• Coach
Coach
Joined: 19.11.2010
Correct.
• Bronze
Joined: 19.05.2011
Ok thanks pleno and all