[NL2-NL10] Donk or check raise?

    • HansTheGreat
      HansTheGreat
      Bronze
      Joined: 14.02.2010 Posts: 3,807
      Hand converted with online PokerStrategy.com hand converter:

      Play hand

      $0.02/$0.05 No-Limit Hold'em (9 handed)

      Known players:
      MP3:
      $7.06
      CO:
      $5.80
      BU:
      $1.35
      SB:
      $5.64
      BB (Hero):
      $6.92
      UTG1:
      $5.00
      UTG2:
      $6.77
      MP1:
      $8.65
      MP2:
      $7.08


      Preflop: Hero is BB with A, 3.
      5 folds, CO raises to $0.15, 2 folds, Hero calls $0.10.

      Flop: ($0.32) 8, 3, A (2 players)
      Hero checks, CO bets $0.20, Hero raises to $0.77, CO calls $0.57.

      Turn: ($1.86) 4 (2 players)
      Hero bets $1.30, CO calls $1.30.

      River: ($4.46) 9 (2 players)
      Hero bets $1.70, CO calls $1.70.

      Final Pot: $7.86.
      Results follow:


      Hero shows two pairs, aces and threes(A 3).CO shows a pair of aces(T A).Hero wins with two pairs, aces and threes(A 3).


      CO stats: 24/14/1.9/CO steal 17%(6)/ FCbet to raise 0%(2)/WTSD 34%(29)/W$SD 40%(10)
  • 10 replies
    • veriz
      veriz
      Black
      Joined: 20.07.2008 Posts: 65,504
      Hello Sikac,

      Why don't you just put him all-in on the river. :P You don't have much left anyways and he also has Ax hands in his calling range there.

      Best Regards.
    • HansTheGreat
      HansTheGreat
      Bronze
      Joined: 14.02.2010 Posts: 3,807
      Originally posted by veriz
      Hello Sikac,

      Why don't you just put him all-in on the river. :P You don't have much left anyways and he also has Ax hands in his calling range there.

      Best Regards.
      On the river he has 3.58 left me 4.7. So you are saying that going broke I mean betting 3.6 is not overplayed? Just want a confirmation for me in bad times. Also check raise is here fine or should I just donk?
    • veriz
      veriz
      Black
      Joined: 20.07.2008 Posts: 65,504
      Originally posted by Sikac
      Originally posted by veriz
      Hello Sikac,

      Why don't you just put him all-in on the river. :P You don't have much left anyways and he also has Ax hands in his calling range there.

      Best Regards.
      On the river he has 3.58 left me 4.7. So you are saying that going broke I mean betting 3.6 is not overplayed? Just want a confirmation for me in bad times. Also check raise is here fine or should I just donk?
      I would just ship the river as I said and yes, I know that he has such an amount left. :P That's also why i said to push. :) Check/Raise is of course fine and even needed to do and get value.
    • HansTheGreat
      HansTheGreat
      Bronze
      Joined: 14.02.2010 Posts: 3,807

      I would just ship the river as I said and yes, I know that he has such an amount left. :P That's also why i said to push. :) Check/Raise is of course fine and even needed to do and get value.
      Just an overall question. In such spots do you think that for the player means any difference the for the case if I push all in or if I just go for such a bet? I mean an all in could make fold a lot of worse Ax hands and such a smaller raise keeps them still in the game for a call. Do you think is this right or not? It is not that I judge your all in it just that I was kinda curios what are people willing to pay.
    • veriz
      veriz
      Black
      Joined: 20.07.2008 Posts: 65,504
      Nah, they rarely fold here Ax hands, especially on those limits. :D
    • sausage646
      sausage646
      Bronze
      Joined: 30.03.2010 Posts: 567
      what about a call pre flop :f_confused: ?

      IMO - standard fold pre flop
    • veriz
      veriz
      Black
      Joined: 20.07.2008 Posts: 65,504
      Originally posted by sausage646
      what about a call pre flop :f_confused: ?

      IMO - standard fold pre flop
      Why should be standard? :D You can perfectly well even play those hands profitable postflop, don't stick always to straight forward play. If you are good postflop then those hands are perfect to play for just $0,10. But if you are bad postflop then fold.
    • sausage646
      sausage646
      Bronze
      Joined: 30.03.2010 Posts: 567
      so maximum you get one street whit value if you hit your ace, I don't see where the profit comes from?

      A4+ dominate us, I don't know about his barreling tendencies, but usually on Axx boards they barrel once whit a bluff, since Axx is not the best for multiple streets + do we want to value bet ?
    • zilltine
      zilltine
      Bronze
      Joined: 20.03.2010 Posts: 395
      Depends on CO opening range? If he opens like A9+, Axs, 22+, KJ+, QJ then i can`t see lots of profit in playing it OOP. If he opens CO like 35% then it is different thing. I guess against 17% (which is something i typed above) range i`d muck it pre
    • veriz
      veriz
      Black
      Joined: 20.07.2008 Posts: 65,504
      Originally posted by sausage646
      so maximum you get one street whit value if you hit your ace, I don't see where the profit comes from?

      A4+ dominate us, I don't know about his barreling tendencies, but usually on Axx boards they barrel once whit a bluff, since Axx is not the best for multiple streets + do we want to value bet ?
      What do you mean from where our profit comes from? By Calling and just hoping to hit we are not talking about. We are also talking about taking stabs on him if we even don't hit. By hoping to hit with any kind of hands by calling you will rarely play any hand profitable, even AK. :D But in this case that's true that it's more safer to rather 3bet it preflop and make it for fold equity if he is folding enough to 3bets. But assuming that we will never play this kind of hands profitable in long run by flatting is not right. :) Write that kind of play somewhere down on peace of paper and come back in few years and lets see what do you think then about the flat. Most of the hands which we Call like that, most of them can't be played profitable by just hoping "oh I will hit I will get paid". You have to play back the hands on specific boards, opponents, situations.

      Depends on CO opening range? If he opens like A9+, Axs, 22+, KJ+, QJ then i can`t see lots of profit in playing it OOP. If he opens CO like 35% then it is different thing. I guess against 17% (which is something i typed above) range i`d muck it pre

      It's just from 6 cases so I wouldn't base on that.