Question for the Pros

    • theloniousbones
      theloniousbones
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      Joined: 30.01.2008 Posts: 177
      Hoping to get some feedback and advice for my poker career moving forward.

      First a bit of background. Some of you my recall my broke and busted blog a couple months ago, though since then I've redeposited to take advantage of a $100 bonus from FTP as compensation for a nasty disconnection problem they had a while back. I had that money going for a while, got $80 worth before it expired, then slowly watched it dwindle when I made an attempt at BSS. I was done. Fed up.

      After about a week I couldn't shake the poker bug, and as I had time while I waited to start a new job I set about playing freerolls, and by posting some hands I encountered I got a good lashing from some coaches, which really sparked me. I realized I had a few leaks, the biggie being too loose in completing the SB, which as I looked back at the numbers, cost me a good chunk of my profits without realizing, as well as needing to tighten up my positional play and starting hand selection.

      Pumped up by this, I redeposited a few bucks as a substitute to play whilst I waited for my rakeback money, and in the time being I was able to run up my BR from $50 (+$33 rakeback) to where I sit now @ $200. I promised myself I would take out the initial investment of $50 and continue, but now I wonder....

      The essence of this is that I'm wondering what works best moving forward. I realize I'm still susceptable to variance, so I'm debating what is the better course of action, either playing SSS @ NL25, where I've had some success, averaging around $3-$5 profit per session playing 2 tables. Slow but steady.

      The other side is that I've made most of my money at NL10 SH tables, far superior to FR, but BSS could lead to greater swings, as the variance is already high at SH tables.

      So I guess all this nonsensical rant was to ask the pros what's better?

      SSS @ NL25 or:
      BSS @ NL10 6-max

      Anyone with the patience to read this mess is welcome with advice and stories of their own experience.

      Cheers!

      Thelonious
  • 17 replies
    • Pbaby
      Pbaby
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      Joined: 11.04.2008 Posts: 9
      don't understand what you are talking about ;(
    • theloniousbones
      theloniousbones
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      Joined: 30.01.2008 Posts: 177
      LOL @ Pbaby....

      I didn't think I was making much sense.... but maybe you just haven't read the articles yet, so....

      BSS = Big Stack Strategy, where you buy into a ring game with 100 Big Blinds, so in the case of NL .05/.10, you sit at the table with $10.

      SSS = Short Stack Strategy, which is the basis for PokerStrategy. Buy in with 20 BB's and only play your premium hands, and play those hands very aggressively.

      So I'm wondering what is the better play for the long term. Playing short-stacked at a higher limit or playing Big Stacked at a lower one. Catch my drift?
    • swissmoumout
      swissmoumout
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      Joined: 23.02.2007 Posts: 3,385
      put it all on 36.
    • Pbaby
      Pbaby
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      Joined: 11.04.2008 Posts: 9
      LOL...I know what SSS is and waht BSS is, no need to explain. :O

      I dont understand your problem. What is exactly your concern? You're saying nonsense :rolleyes:
    • theloniousbones
      theloniousbones
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      Joined: 30.01.2008 Posts: 177
      Originally posted by swissmoumout
      put it all on 36.
      Red or Black?
    • swissmoumout
      swissmoumout
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      Joined: 23.02.2007 Posts: 3,385
      hmmm

      red!
    • SoyCD
      SoyCD
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      Joined: 20.02.2008 Posts: 6,356
      I think it depends on what you want to do and what style of game you want to concentrate on:

      For me playing SSS is best if it is multitabled as in atleast 6+ but preferably even more tables. Its a good tool for increasing the bankroll, and if you play enough tables - and play it well enough can be quite profitable. So if you are looking at being mainly a profit-> many table player-> SSS is an option.

      If you are more interested in perfecting your game, and understanding of it. Like reading your opponents, and are not necessarily a big fan of multitableing I would stick to the BSS. Playing BSS at lower limits, posting hands, and perfecting your poker skills is definitely +EV not only from the money but also experience perspective.

      So essentially: Unless you move and do way more than 2 tables SSS -> go for BSS :)

      Best regards,
      SoyCD
    • thunderbird56
      thunderbird56
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      Joined: 02.12.2007 Posts: 2,182
      I'll focus on choosing between BSS and SSS.

      The bigger the stack is, the more you can lose with one hand. The bigger the stack is, the more you can win with one hand. So with BSS, your good skills can pay off much, and your mistake is also much more expensive. With the short stack strategy, you can win always small amounts regardless how strong your hand is.

      From the above concept, we can draw a conclusion that: a good BS will earn more than a good SS. Therefore, which type to play depends on your skills. If you're new to poker, and have small bankroll, stay with BSS until you have a proper bankroll (at least 20 stacks) as well as have mastered all aspects of the game.

      Now regarding your specfic query: I would say: NL SH if you've prepared all for that.

      Good luck!
      thunderbird56
    • theloniousbones
      theloniousbones
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      Joined: 30.01.2008 Posts: 177
      Thank you Soy and Thunderbird!

      I'm glad somebody understood that post ;)

      I think I'll be trying BSS @ NL10 6-max. More fish ;) . ~$200 BR is enough, no?

      Thanks for the advice and I'll keep you posted.

      :D
    • xylere
      xylere
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      Joined: 27.05.2007 Posts: 2,939
      it absolutely doesn't make any sense to play 2 tables SSS. The fastest way to grind is to play 10-12 tables SSS. Otherwise, play with a big stack.
    • SonicXT
      SonicXT
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      Joined: 15.06.2007 Posts: 4,736
      Originally posted by theloniousbones
      The essence of this is that I'm wondering what works best moving forward. I realize I'm still susceptable to variance, so I'm debating what is the better course of action, either playing SSS @ NL25, where I've had some success, averaging around $3-$5 profit per session playing 2 tables. Slow but steady.
      When you're not susceptable to it anymore, will you teach me ?
    • swissmoumout
      swissmoumout
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      Joined: 23.02.2007 Posts: 3,385
      Originally posted by SonicXT
      Originally posted by theloniousbones
      The essence of this is that I'm wondering what works best moving forward. I realize I'm still susceptable to variance, so I'm debating what is the better course of action, either playing SSS @ NL25, where I've had some success, averaging around $3-$5 profit per session playing 2 tables. Slow but steady.
      When you're not susceptable to it anymore, will you teach me ?
      How to be successful in poker: Part 1
    • Nunki
      Nunki
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      Joined: 25.10.2006 Posts: 865
      If I was in your position at FTP with $200 I'd play some SSS at NL25 AND some BSS at NL25?!. To be specific, I'd impose an initial rule upon myself of only playing SSS if I had less than 45BI's (900BB's) otherwise I'd consider buying-in fullstacked especially if a certain table seemed a bit fishy. The experience gained playing SSS will also be of obvious direct benefit to your BSS in this case.
      If you are able to build and maintain a stack in this manner then you will be able to take shots at just about any game you want to. Your risk of ruin (ROR) will be relatively small.

      If you play directly NL10SH then you have a much bigger risk of going broke since not only is there typically higher variance playing BSS but also 10% rake at FTP on these games. You will need a very large edge over your opponents to make up for this and if you are a beginning player this is very unlikely. If you don't mind re-depositing then ROR considertions become less important.


      Remember that playing well on two tables is often better than playing poorly on six. Good luck.
    • slikec
      slikec
      Global
      Joined: 04.02.2008 Posts: 1,155
      Originally posted by xylere
      it absolutely doesn't make any sense to play 2 tables SSS. The fastest way to grind is to play 10-12 tables SSS. Otherwise, play with a big stack.
      Out of topic:
      Is sth. wrong with me since i play 10-12 tables BSS?
    • SoyCD
      SoyCD
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      Joined: 20.02.2008 Posts: 6,356
      Originally posted by slikec
      Originally posted by xylere
      it absolutely doesn't make any sense to play 2 tables SSS. The fastest way to grind is to play 10-12 tables SSS. Otherwise, play with a big stack.
      Out of topic:
      Is sth. wrong with me since i play 10-12 tables BSS?
      Nope ;) If you have the experience and talent for it there is nothing wrong with increasing the table numbers, if it has a positive effect on your overall winnings.

      Especially for FR BSS I think a lot of people play 12+ tables once they have reached a certain level of experience.
    • xylere
      xylere
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      Joined: 27.05.2007 Posts: 2,939
      I don't know about FR, but I play 2-3 tables SH and I am not going to add any more. I would better play 2 tables on NL 400, then 8 tables on NL 50.
    • helemaalnicks
      helemaalnicks
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      Joined: 21.09.2007 Posts: 7,195
      np with playing 12 tables. What is a problem however, is playing too many tables, but you have to determine yourself how many is too many...