Say Hello To One Of The Biggest Losers In Online Poker

    • WinningTrips
      WinningTrips
      Bronze
      Joined: 24.03.2012 Posts: 37
      Hello Fellow Poker Players,

      This is my story about how I lost nearly $100K in two years playing small stakes.

      Two years ago a friend of mine introduced me to a card game called POKER. He invited a few close friends including myself to a home poker night. Each of us brought 200 one pence coins and had a very good time playing Limit Hold’em. Before that magical night I knew close to nothing about poker, but the very next day I was watching ‘High Stakes Poker’ on TV. Soon it became one of my favourite TV shows.

      Have to mention here that in the last 15 years I never had money related problems. No, I’m not a billionaire but I own and run a few small businesses which at least pay my bills. Fatally my love affair with poker started when I was fed up with an office based job. The idea that I could be sitting under the palm tree on the beach and make money playing poker was so fascinating I couldn’t resist. I was more than absolutely convinced that very soon I will be able to outplay those young kids playing online to make some extra money. Registered accounts on Poker Stars and Full Tilt Poker (without any bonus promotions and rakeback obviously) and dived straight in to full ring cash games. Despite I was losing money I found FR games too boring because I’m an action man in real life. After a month or two I was playing 50NL 6-max games.

      Probably it’s not worth saying that back then I didn’t know anything about HEM, PT3, HUD’s, etc. I had no idea about TAG’s, LAG’s and about any poker strategies what so ever. I bet, raised, re-raised, bluff-showed without any consideration. No wonder I was losing money at an astronomical rate. But losing money was not an issue. I make money easy and spend even easier. The issue soon became the fact that other players at the tables where laughing at me and calling me ***** guess what??? Yes, you are right – A FISH :s_mad: . Those college kids call me - a man with reputation a fish!!! :s_mad: This was unbearable. Besides that I quickly noticed that as soon as I started playing - waiting lists at all my tables grew from zero to 15.

      As probably most people I hate losing. It did not take long for myself to realise that is I want to start winning I must study the game. So I bought some popular poker books from Amazon including everything written by David Sklansky and Ed Miller. Reading books helped a little bit. I was not losing money at an astronomical rate anymore, but in general I remained a huge loser. Now I was not only losing money at poker but also spending on poker books.

      Reading theory books did not produce desirable results and I started looking for some more practical study approach. Online poker training sites looked like the right way to go. But which is the best one? So I enrolled with most of them: Card Runners, Deuces Cracked, Lego Poker, Poker Savvy, Drag The Bar, you name it… Now I’m still losing money playing poker, have bought lots of poker books and paying training membership fees… :) But the most horrible thing at that time was that more videos I watched more money I was losing. I was watching training materials of the best poker coaches. The poker concepts sounded very good, advanced and clever but as was applying them in my games I almost always ended up losing more money. In addition to my financial losses I had bought every poker tool recommended my coaches.

      At that point I became quite desperate. I knew that I’m not a retard. How can it be that I’m able to be successful in business, able to build a comfortable lifestyle for myself and my family and not being able to beat poker games? I was very close to a final conclusion that online poker being controlled by criminals is rigged and designed only for people as myself to lose money. And then I decided to give it a last go. I decided to carry out my own No Limit Hold’em investigation. I bought 2.000000 (two million) Poker Stars 200NL 6-max hands, sorted out the highest winners of this stake and studied their game throughout. And now some pieces of the puzzle started to come together. A friend of mine send me a collection of PokerStrategy.com strategy articles from beginner to advanced which as I can clearly see now was a missing corner stone for my poker mind. Something just clicked in my head and suddenly I realised why BalugaWhale named his book ‘Easy Game’. Finally I understood why learning from training videos had such a negative impact for my game. It was because those materials where meant for people who already know poker basics. However I was trying to build something big and advanced without laying the deep foundation. I had no fundamental understanding of the games I was playing and was applying advanced poker concepts often in the wrong spots and at the wrong time. I just hope that my money I lost to online kids went for their college or uni education and not for drugs, alcohol and hookers. :P

      So I’d say today I am self-taught poker player able to play 9 tables with slight win rate at 200NL. I feel that probably I’m ready to battle for my $100K I’d lost (including money spent on books, training, software, etc.).

      From 1st April I'm starting a 90 Day chalenge towards winning my money back. Maybe I will be posting it to a relevant forum section here if such exist.

      Would you guys be willing to share what books, training series or coaches helped your poker game the most?

      What was your Eureka moment which maybe turned your game around?

      :spade: :heart: :diamond: :club: Any comments, tips and advice is welcome and will be highly appreciated :spade: :heart: :diamond: :club:
  • 76 replies
    • ItsTeddyKGB
      ItsTeddyKGB
      Bronze
      Joined: 10.01.2011 Posts: 734
      Nice blog entry! Definately gonna keep watching this one. =)
    • roopopper
      roopopper
      Bronze
      Joined: 31.12.2010 Posts: 4,289
      cool story :f_biggrin: :f_biggrin:

      Especially about those young kids wasting their monies on college and uni when there are so many drugs and hookers to bu... ?( wait a minute did I get confused again? must be the alcohol :f_biggrin:

      Good luck and welcome to ps :f_thumbsup:

      Roo
    • 1984ioc
      1984ioc
      Bronze
      Joined: 16.07.2011 Posts: 712
      Quite the introduction.Think you should set the challenge at winning as much as possible back in 90 days and not the full amount especially if you are playing NL200 and only a slight winner.My 2cents anyway.You might ask the mods to move this to the blog section and good luck anyway.Will follow as well.
    • VorpalF2F
      VorpalF2F
      Super Moderator
      Super Moderator
      Joined: 02.09.2010 Posts: 8,915
      Originally posted by WinningTripsFrom 1st April I'm starting a 90 Day chalenge towards winning my money back. Maybe I will be posting it to a relevant forum section here if such exist.
      I do hope you're not challenging yourself to win 100K in 90 days.
      That way lies madness.

      From your post I see some indications of ego -- like when you were upset that kids were name-calling such a respectable gentleman as yourself.

      You've come to the right place -- both mentally and physically.
      Good luck -- we'll be watching...
    • Borisian
      Borisian
      Bronze
      Joined: 28.01.2012 Posts: 947
      Go get 'em!
    • l3allista
      l3allista
      Basic
      Joined: 22.03.2012 Posts: 17
      Hi there,

      The article blog post was awesome, but was so sorry that you lost quite some hugh amount of money. I've been playing poker at 888poker for over a year now playing small blinds and been winning quite a bit and been winning quite a amount on tourneys. i guess 888poker is one of the best online poker there. Hey why don't you add me at my skype : xxxxx [edited by gadget51: 25/03/2012] and I could give you some tips, etc etc which helped me in my poker experience.

      Why not come and play at 888poker for a time and see how it goes, keep me posted how your profit is going etc.

      Cheers

      satya

      I have edited out your skype as the first contact should be via our community tool. We do it this way for online securiy reasons and trust you understand.

      Regards,

      Mal.
    • Resilence
      Resilence
      Bronze
      Joined: 10.03.2012 Posts: 934
      cute post and welcome :)
    • mrauter
      mrauter
      Bronze
      Joined: 24.03.2010 Posts: 200
      Very interesting read.

      What I found facinating about your post is that you had the drive to keep studying and learning the game, even when you were losing heaps of money.

      Most people on this forum were lucky enough to start on this website full of excelent articles and a methodology that focus on the fundamentals at first. But just like you 90% of the population starts playing at home games and then deposit on a pokersite thinking they will be the next big thing, and just like you they will reach that conclusion:

      I was very close to a final conclusion that online poker being controlled by criminals is rigged and designed only for people as myself to lose money.
      End of story. Glad you had more to tell after that.

      Good luck.
    • gadget51
      gadget51
      Bronze
      Joined: 23.06.2008 Posts: 5,622
      Hi there WinningTrips and welcome to our community!

      So, that's quite the introduction you posted there, wow!

      Ok, so, a couple of suggestions for you that may help.

      First, walk before you run. You know this, you have a good brain, but it's so easy to overlook it. If you start to run and stumble, go back to walking. This of course implies you can swallow your pride, but you get the point I hope.

      Secondly, a challenge can be great for motivation, which is why many people start a blog, http://www.pokerstrategy.com/forum/board.php?boardid=1435 so others can follow, give feedback and generally comment on your progress. You can also post hands and have them analyzed by our experts as well as everyone else with an interest in what you are doing.

      Third - and I may be reiterating a little, the members of this community are the best there is out there of the type, thus you will get as much help as you need to get crushing the game.

      Finally, if you feel you are enjoying your journey with us, please feel free to use the Tell a Friend link at the bottom of this post! :)

      If you need anything further just ask.

      Good luck with your journey WinningTrips , have fun with Pokerstrategy.com and welcome again.

      Very best regards,

      Mal.
    • WinningTrips
      WinningTrips
      Bronze
      Joined: 24.03.2012 Posts: 37
      Thank you all for such a warm welcome.

        A few words about my upcoming '90 Day’ challenge: Of course it’s not about making $100K in 90 days. In fact it’s much more humble than that. I’m playing on William Hill Poker skin on iPoker and have a very good rakeback deal there. Bad thing is that often there is not enough tables running during the day and I’m not always able to play evenings because I have a family and some rather important social obligations. For this reason at the moment I’m playing combined 200NL games on iPoker and Party together.   My idea is that starting April 1st I’ll be playing Party full time and try to reach ‘Paladium Elite’ status the following quarter. Hopefully my multitableing skills will improve during those 90 days and I will be able to add 2-4 tables latter on and maintain ‘Paladium Elite’ status afterwards while playing both Party and iPoker having somewhat similar rakeback on both.   I was running horribly under EV all this week which knocked my win rate down to 2.6 bb/100. My results this week are  -$860 actual dollars vs $1400 EV Adjusted dollars. What a shift…! Huh? I will be happy if I’m able to make $4500 including rakeback in those 90 days. Those funds would go to buy two 30 inch Dell monitors and some beastly powerful but virtualy silent mini PC. Currently I’m on 27Inch iMac, but running Windows on BootCamp is not enough to run 8 tables, TableNinja and HEM since I upgraded to HM2.   
    • WinningTrips
      WinningTrips
      Bronze
      Joined: 24.03.2012 Posts: 37
      From your post I see some indications of ego -- like when you were upset that kids were name-calling such a respectable gentleman as yourself.


      Spot on. There is a lot of ego involved. Even the fact that I carry on with playing poker is an ego thing. I have lots of ways I can make $100K in 6-12 months. In fact at this very moment my friends are starting a new chain of restaurants in London and I could be a part of it. But I just want to prove to myself that I can be a winning poker player. I do even understand that this may even be silly, but that’s how my cookie crumbles. I’ve done some silly moves in the past and some of them made me quite a bit of money.

      What I found facinating about your post is that you had the drive to keep studying and learning the game, even when you were losing heaps of money


      Unfortunately I'm far from fluent in English and find hard to express my thoughts the way I’d love to. I would tell you about my journey in search for leaks in my game. It’s interesting enough how I was discovering holes in my game and went to look after some patches to them. Found them, applied them just to discover later that some wrong patch opened even bigger leak in different area… How many times I was relieved with the ‘breakthrough’ just to find out a while latter that it was just a short hot run.

      I remember those days when I started to study the game and learned a few things about starting hands. Every time I saw a guy at the table playing 45/20 I started bombarding them relentlessly. My understanding was very simple:’ he is 45/20 ‘fish’ :s_evil: and I’m much better player because I play less hands - therefore I must win against him every time.’
      And this is a classic scenario: I open AQs on the BTN and 45/20 BB calls. The flop is A,9,4 rainbow. I bet close to the pot and my ‘fish’ :s_evil: shoves all-in 200bb. I snap-call 200bb and of course he shows 94o. Oh man I hope you don’t want to hear what would inevitably happen after that… I’d be rampaging this poor table with the great vengeance and furious anger until I had 10-15 buy-ins lost. As a default scenario ‘45/20’ wins 4-5 buy-ins from me in the next hour or two, loses everything to the regs and disappears from the table leavening me with a loaded gun in my hand. I must tell that for a long time I was honestly convinced that such loses with AQs against 94o where because of my opponents fishy play pre-flop but not because of my bad calls post-flop.

      This is how I realised the meaning of the word ‘TILT’. With English not being my first language for a long time I thought that ‘tilt’ is just some insignificant poker jargon such as ‘fish’, ‘donkey’ or ‘idiot’ :) . And as soon as I realised that it’s probably the biggest leak in the games of most people including very good and talented players I had to deal with it. I’m good at self-discipline and it did not take long to quit those crusades of revenge after ‘unfair’ loses. But it took another long time to realise that instead of bursting with aggression I was falling in to passive tilt mode and calling a lot in hope to hit huge. Damn… another losing play… ?( .
    • roopopper
      roopopper
      Bronze
      Joined: 31.12.2010 Posts: 4,289
      Why dont you ask the mods to move this thread to the blog section? you will get much more feedback from other members there :)

      Roo
    • conall88
      conall88
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.01.2009 Posts: 1,715
      If you have lost ~$100k I would call it a day m8....

      saying you have mindset/tilt issues would be an understatement.
    • WinningTrips
      WinningTrips
      Bronze
      Joined: 24.03.2012 Posts: 37
      Why dont you ask the mods to move this thread to the blog section? you will get much more feedback from other members there smile


      Because I'm new here I gues... :) If gadget51 could be so kind and move my introduction to the blogs it would be nice. In fact I've never been a forum man. Just recently I registered with 2+2 and of course PokerStrategy.com as those strategy articles helped me a lot to become a better player.

      As I'm serious about setting up some goals and challenges I think that recording my progress and development is a good idea. The blog format suits this even better. And if some more experienced players would follow my thread and be willing to discuss some difficult spots I frequently find myself in it would be just perfect.

      The illustration to this would be my former understanding of ‘Bad Beat’. Let’s say I had KT in my hand and the flop comes - K,9,4 rainbow. I’d bet ¾ of the pot. Turn – J. I bet, opponent calls. River – let’s say 6. No flush possibilities. I’d bet river regardless of my opponent. And if he turned up two pair hand such as K9s, or KJ I’d call this ‘Bad Beat’ . And it took me a long time to figure it out that in most cases it was ‘Bad Play’ and not ‘Bad Beat’. I was surprised when someone told me that ‘Bad Beat’ is when your Full House is beat by Quads or your Quads by Straight Flush…. :)

      These days the same situation with KT would be very much opponent dependant. If my opponent 19/15 tight reg. with high folds to flop and turn C-bets and low showdown a Check/Fold on the river would be my most likely action.

      But still there are some hands I would like to discuss. For instance I often lose with sets against bigger sets. Or lose when getting in on the flop with set on a draw heavy board… And I have doubts if I’m playing those spots correctly…
    • roopopper
      roopopper
      Bronze
      Joined: 31.12.2010 Posts: 4,289
      Have you taken the Quiz yet?
      You might as well get the free $50 starting capital and it will then give you bronze status and release more articles, also you will have a tracked account so the more you play the more articles and videos you can watch.
      You can then post hand histories in the HE threads and get a professional coach to judge them.
      At the levels of poker you are talking of playing you will reach a high level of articles very quickly.

      Roo
    • WinningTrips
      WinningTrips
      Bronze
      Joined: 24.03.2012 Posts: 37
      Hi Roopopper

      Sadly I already have accounts on most biggest poker sites. Besides I have bankroll to play 200NL so $50 of starting capital would not make a huge impact :) . However If another disaster stikes and I blow my current roll away, then I will probably grab those $50 and start from mocrostakes..
    • ExternalUseOnly
      ExternalUseOnly
      Bronze
      Joined: 30.01.2010 Posts: 3,373
      Hey sir :) ,

      Nice intro very interesting read, i've moved this to blogs for you and left a link in the old board so you don't lose your post :) Really looking forward to reading about the next stage of your journey, looks like you've had a pretty rough ride so far.

      You probably know this already but its really important to work on your mental game/attitude as much as any other part of your game you should check this thread out: +++Q&A with Jared Tendler!!+++ Jared is the daddy when it comes to mindset issues and just reading through the thread has helped a huge number of members already

      Good luck with your goals, will be following

      Carl
    • nefarious26
      nefarious26
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.11.2008 Posts: 413
      Originally posted by WinningTrips
      Hi Roopopper

      Sadly I already have accounts on most biggest poker sites. Besides I have bankroll to play 200NL so $50 of starting capital would not make a huge impact :) . However If another disaster stikes and I blow my current roll away, then I will probably grab those $50 and start from mocrostakes..
      just because you have the roll to play nl200 dont mean you should be playing it, you done 50 buyins 100k learning some very basic lessons
      you should of learn the hard way at nl 0.50p and 50 buyins 2.5k


      when you say you was/are playing nl 200 is the 200 or 2000 pull up?
    • Solidius
      Solidius
      Bronze
      Joined: 27.12.2010 Posts: 209
      Very interesting read. I added your blog to favorites and i am looking forward seeing the progress of your challenge. ;)