ZOOM poker strategy, Please help!

    • Vip3rNZ
      Joined: 11.11.2011 Posts: 340
      Hey guys, i'm going to tell everyone my zoom poker strategy and if anyone could tell me anything i'm doing wrong that'd be awesome.

      I'm also getting it down so it's not just all in my head O.o

      Ok so i'm playing 4 tables 9max Zoom poker at 2NL and everytime my bankroll hits $60 i take a 2 BI shot at 5NL.

      Currently my bankroll is $35

      Highest point was $90

      And i started with $10 deposit at Pokerstars which is where i'm playing.

      So far i'm up $55 at 2NL and down $30 at 5nl

      I've played about 15k hands at 5nl and over 50k hands at 2nl ( I feel like this is ALOT )

      After about 30k hands total my HEM2 stoped tracking my zoom poker hands for som reason... so that was really annoying.. still wont track them if anyone could help with that would be cool.

      Ok so this is my strategy,

      I raise to 3BB +1 per limper from any position with all pocket pairs AK AQ AJ ATs. Then i fold everything except AK AA KK QQ to a 3bet. I the 3bet with QQ and ALL-IN with AA KK and AK.

      On the flop i will C-Bet with any of these cards against 1 person on any board even if i totally miss and then fold to a raise and check fold turn if they call. If i totally miss against 2+ I will check/fold the flop.

      If I hit TPTK with my AJ AQ AK, i will make a C-Bet and then call if im raised and then try and keep the pot small by playing check/call untill showdown unless they make a huge overbet then i will generally just fold.

      If i hit a set with one of my pocketpairs i will play check/call on a dry flop, if they check-behind i will donk the turn. If they bet I will call and check-raise the turn.

      If I hit a fullhouse or quads I play this way also on any board, wet or dry.

      If the board is paired I will play check/raise and then check/fold on turn/river if they call unless i have an overpair then I will play check / call unless they make a really big bet then I will play check/fold.

      If the board is Mono I will make a cbet on the flop, if they raise i will call and check/call a turn card of an off suit to the board and check/fold another same suit card. Same goes for the river.

      I raise to 3BB +1 per limper from Cutoff or Button with 67s+ A2s+ KQo+ ATo+

      with these cards i mostly raise for a steal and get confused from there on.

      I understand there is alot i have left out and alot that is probly just plain wrong. Please remember that in zoom poker you have little to no reads on anyone at all and no hud.

      ANYTHING that i have missed that you think will help me please tell me i really need as much help i can get, i will keep editing this post and changing my strategy addingthings people tell me and help me to understand and change.

      Thanks ALOT for reading and please post somthing to try and help my game :D
  • 16 replies
    • nathanrenard
      Joined: 09.02.2009 Posts: 816
      Variance playing 4 tables of Rush/Zoom is sick. I advise better brm, less tables until you get the hang of it.

      Its just poker, (some) people close their range a bit but thats it, plus NL2, NL5 is crazy everywhere.

      Just play solid, and stop trying to play more than you can handle.
    • Vip3rNZ
      Joined: 11.11.2011 Posts: 340
      Thanks for the advice, I'm sure i can handle 4 tables, it's not to fast or anything i have plenty of time to make my decisions.

      Why is the variance playing 4 tables any diff from 1 table?

      Why is Rush/Zoom poker higher Variance?

      How should I adjust my game if (some) people are playing tighter if i dont know which ones, is it worth tightening my game for everyone which is what i'd have to do, or just keeping it as is?

      I'm really full of questions, nomatter what anyone says i will question the hell out of it i really want to understand everything in the fullest detail! :D

      Thanks for replying.
    • mineriva
      Joined: 30.04.2008 Posts: 913

      I played a lot of rush when it was alive and played a bit of zoom now.
      NB playing 50BB

      Raise size:
      In an unopened pot I believe you can openraise 4BB from early and 3 BB from late. This is to cut the implieds for the set miners and to cut the rewards for the 3betting blinds.

      After limpers I raise 3 + 1 per limper.

      In a raise pot I 3 bet 3x Raise amount less 1BB if I am bluffing or plus 1BB if I am value raising or oop. Because of the nature of the game this is unexploitable.

      I 4bet allin.


      4bet range: Unless we have a clear read QQ is -EV. KK is a crying call.
      3 bet range: I try to stick to the MSS basic 3 bet range unless I stats on villian.
      Open raise and steal raise I stick to MSS basic.
    • NightFrostaSS
      Joined: 25.10.2008 Posts: 5,255
      Originally posted by nathanrenard
      Variance playing 4 tables of Rush/Zoom is sick. I advise better brm, less tables until you get the hang of it.
      I used to grind FR rush NL100 on FTP and disagree with you. Standard deviation in FR rush is very low.

      In SH rush it was a bit higher than on normal tables.

      OP, well I haven't played NL2 rush/zoom so it's kinda hard to say. I did beat NL100 fr rush for a solid winrate so I do think I have some insight on beating these games. IMO in general as you move up the games become more nitty (at least that was the case w moving up from NL50 FR rush to NL100 FR rush) and you'll get to save bets more imo.

      You should be folding your TPTK's and overpairs to strong aggression like raise and bet on turn and stuff like that. In fact there were many regulars against whom it was just like donating money to just call flop raise w/o a middle set.

      Another thing is with 3bets, flatting UTG raisers w QQ/KK used to be pretty standard, otherwise you just ISO yourself against AA when they 4bet so there's more value in flatting thant 3b/folding. However you could 3bet some broadways stuff that you don't feel like flatting vs UTG.

      With multiple flatters fold very low pairs vs early raisers so not to get set over set etc.

      Open raise looser from BU.

      There is HUD for zoom/rush :P PT3 has it and so does HEM2.

      Okay, I just woke up and cba to post more, skipped some stuff you wrote as well, so I guess I'll add some stuff later on If you wish.
    • Vip3rNZ
      Joined: 11.11.2011 Posts: 340
      @mineriva I mostly play BSS altho i've been known to give MSS a try. Some of the info will be very useful thanks!

      Thanks NightFrostaSS you've given me alot of very useful information! I'd very much like more as much as you acn help me with would be amazing.

      Hmm well my HEM2 Doesn't seem to be showing a hud OR even tracking my hands anymore, altho it was for awhile.
    • Vip3rNZ
      Joined: 11.11.2011 Posts: 340
      FUCK this game is driving me CRAZY!

      How the fuck do people make a living playing poker and im getting destroyed at fucking 5nl..

      and barely beating 2nl.. after over 50k hands like a hundred hours of playing poker.. its driving me fucking absolutly insane.. my bankroll is down to $25.

      HOW do people get past this shit.. seriously
    • Atoks
      Joined: 01.06.2008 Posts: 1,397
      Originally posted by Vip3rNZ

      HOW do people get past this shit.. seriously
      Patience, lots of studying of the game, learning not to tilt, those are just some of the basics ... there's a lot more advanced stuff that one learns through reviews/sweat sessions or coachings ... so it's not just work at the table, there should be loads of work away from the table as well if u want to make a decent living by playing poker.
    • keoghh
      Joined: 01.07.2011 Posts: 857
      Hey, i feel like im having the same problem, ive been playing nl2 SH zoom, ive beaten nl2 SH over about 40k hands previous to zoom, so i feel i can beat it over a large sample size. However im struggling to adjust to zoom and feel like im just donating money atm so i decided to have a break from zoom.

      After what nightfrost posted i feel my strategy for zoom is wrong in most places, seems like i need to 'nit' up, any other tips for zoom guys??

      Ps. If you wana discuss some zoom strategy on skype etc im down for that, just add me and we'll swap skypes. :D
    • mbml
      Joined: 27.11.2008 Posts: 20,779
      everyone is nittier in general, but at higher limits the LAGs get more aggressive because they believe they can push the nits off their hands

      since the player pool is so large at lower stakes I believe you can just use 1-2 street aggression more often and just fold to checkraises cos they should be more nutted - general mentality is to quick fold shit and move on to the next hand and try to nut peddle
    • Vip3rNZ
      Joined: 11.11.2011 Posts: 340
      If i was to make a video of me playing zoom poker would anyone watch it and try help me out at all? or does that cost?
    • mute20
      Joined: 13.01.2011 Posts: 564
      fr 2nl is pretty easy to beat. I haven't even been running especially well with a lot of suckouts to the opposition my aa vs kk/jj them hitting the set. The key I believe to rush is knowing when your beat.
    • VorpalF2F
      Super Moderator
      Super Moderator
      Joined: 02.09.2010 Posts: 10,358
      If i hit a set with one of my pocketpairs i will play check/call on a dry flop, if they check-behind i will donk the turn. If they bet I will call and check-raise the turn.
      Why not bet for value?
      If they have something they like, you get more money.
      If they don't, they'll fold, but you would have wasted a bunch of time checking down to the river any way.
      If you bet, they fold, you get their coinage, and its on to the next hand faster.
      If they call, then you can get more value from them on the turn and river.
      If they raise, you might even be able to stack 'em.

      If bet nothing at all, though, you get double your bet back, and if double zero is OK by you...
    • NightFrostaSS
      Joined: 25.10.2008 Posts: 5,255
      Originally posted by Vip3rNZ
      FUCK this game is driving me CRAZY!

      How the fuck do people make a living playing poker and im getting destroyed at fucking 5nl..
      It takes time, I too got destroyed at NL5 long time ago. :f_biggrin: You seem to have good attitude towards studying the game and trying to improve, so you'll be fine.

      Originally posted by keoghh
      After what nightfrost posted i feel my strategy for zoom is wrong in most places, seems like i need to 'nit' up, any other tips for zoom guys??
      It's not rly nittting it up, it's just that your opponents are nitting it up so you get to adjust your stacking off ranges accordingly when they start showing aggression. There were some regs against whom I'd get to 5bet bluff or call down w garbage, but that was done w lots of history and w/o it it's better to imagine that he's just another nit.

      Also if you play SH zoom I do feel it differs greatly from FR zoom. Much more aggression, especially preflop (probably not the case @ NL2) and stacking off ranges are obv wider than in FR.

      With that said, I still do feel like you kinda should lean on the tighter side playing NL2 SH, mainly because of how brutal rake is at micros.
    • UlverHead
      Joined: 14.01.2011 Posts: 4
      Just my 2c

      I beat 2nl fullring over 130k hand sample then I decided to try zoom.
      In my first 10k hands I was up like 28-30 bi.I thought,wow,pretty easy.Then variance hit and at 20k hands I stopped with 10 bi profit.Not a great winrate.

      I believe zoom is very swingy,and I realised that when huds started to work that I get much more 3bets when I try to steal the blinds from ,mp+2 with almost any two,which was very profitable the first days.I dont use one.

      Back to normal fr and I feel my game is pretty solid again.If you can't handle large swings I suggest stick to normal games.
    • reggie123
      Joined: 31.03.2009 Posts: 342
      Few tips for nl2-nl5.
      1. Make notes, even better use pt3. Knowledge is power there. Lots of lag gamblers, who will open with any2, if you dont know who they are, you loose money. Tons of real nits, know who they are. Even some small things, What nationality is the oponent, may be important.
      2. If you cant win with 4 tables, then play with 2!!! Its not important how many hands you play, only proffit. I did start with 4 tables but 10k hands and -3 bi then change it to 2 and 12bb/100..
      3. Know when you are beat. Its hard, sometimes you can bet in every street with AK and still win on showdown if there's is no AK on board, sometimes you should fold it affter flop. It takes time and experience for this.
      4. Deffend your blinds. Most of the players love to raise from button when there's no ation before. I 3bet from SB allmost any2, it looks strong, most of the time they fold affter that, if you face the 4bet then give up.
      5. Marginal spots. Dont play crapp against shortstack. Its not profitable. But if you are bigstack and there's a oopraise from ather bigstack then you should call with allmost any suited crapp.
      6. MP3-CO are real buttons, use then a lot. Dont look your cards, its not important.
      7. Betsizing, use 2,5-3bb for preflop openraise.
      8. 4bet is strong, dont slowplay preflop, if you are down 2-3bi then leave table, clear your mind, dont ever tilt, its so easy to loose 4-5bi on tilt, observe yourself all the time.
    • Spungeh
      Joined: 29.06.2011 Posts: 1,212
      a few things for zoom..

      raise 3x on the BTN with any two cards if noone has limped/raised before you.. this will work for on NL5 better from my experiance, but if someone calls you, then cbet on 90% boards.. make good judgement here, but most the time he will 3bet or fold, so fold to a 3bet, if got shit hand.. or you take down the blinds..

      played looser, everyone folds quickly :)