[NL20-NL50] SH50 - Defend against 3B

    • chocular77
      chocular77
      Bronze
      Joined: 15.06.2010 Posts: 1,102
      Known players:
      Position:
      Stack
      SB:
      $67,1
      Hero:
      $46,1

      0,25/0,5 No-Limit Hold'em (6 handed)
      Hand recorder used for this poker hand: PokerStrategy.com Elephant 0.106 by www.pokerstrategy.com.

      SB 3B = 19%
      Fto4B = 75% (4)

      CB (in3b pot) = 80% (5)
      CB (regular) = 74%


      Preflop: Hero is CO with A:heart: , J:diamond:
      2 folds, Hero raises to $1,50, BU folds, SB raises to $4,50, BB folds, Hero calls $3,00.

      He won't go broke with weaker hands so i called IP to keep in his weak range.

      Flop: ($9,50) K:diamond: , T:diamond: , 9:spade: (2 players)
      SB bets $4,25, Hero raises to $15,00, SB folds, Hero gets uncalled bet back.

      He cbets a lot and his sizing looks weak.
      I could float but if i had something i would also raise since i don't want to give him another card. + don't want to give him another chance to barrel again.

      Is this a good move against such a high 3B? Or should i wait with such moves until i get more hands on him?
  • 11 replies
    • pleno1
      pleno1
      Coach
      Coach
      Joined: 19.11.2010 Posts: 5,596
      Hey, if he doesn't go broke post flop very often and he folds to alot of 4bets whilst 3betting relentlessly I think this is a good hand to 4bet fold.
    • chocular77
      chocular77
      Bronze
      Joined: 15.06.2010 Posts: 1,102
      Originally posted by pleno1
      Hey, if he doesn't go broke post flop very often and he folds to alot of 4bets whilst 3betting relentlessly I think this is a good hand to 4bet fold.
      Wouldn't i want to 4b/f weaker hands? And call him with hands which are ahead of his 3betting range?
    • pleno1
      pleno1
      Coach
      Coach
      Joined: 19.11.2010 Posts: 5,596
      sure, I think 4betting hands like k9 are good as well. AJ is close between 4b/f and flatting in position. If suited then I 100% call, off suit just plays a little worse, his turn aggression is quite important as we don't want to call alot of flops and fold alot of turns.
    • chocular77
      chocular77
      Bronze
      Joined: 15.06.2010 Posts: 1,102
      What else are good hands for calling IP against a wide 3B range?
      Suited Broadways in generell and pp?

      Don't wanted to include turn cbet/af since i don't have much data on him.

      So far his AF by streets is 3,8/8,0/2,7

      His high turn AF was also a factor for raising directly on the flop.
    • pleno1
      pleno1
      Coach
      Coach
      Joined: 19.11.2010 Posts: 5,596
      yeh suited broadways, 910s, AA/KK/QQ/JJ
    • EmanuelC16
      EmanuelC16
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.01.2010 Posts: 13,897
      I like the move with the nut gutter when you can have quite a few good hands, A :diamond: would've been way better, but J :diamond: does also give you a little extra.

      Unfortunately, your sizing is awful, it's over 3x his bet. If you want to construct a flop cbet raising range in 3bet pot you have to make it small. You could actually just click it back if you manage to think of a good range against the right opponent.

      In this case, about $10-11 will have the same result as your raise to $15. I don't think any equity hand will have doubts about shoving over either sizings and I don't think a hand like QQ goes crazy against either.
    • chocular77
      chocular77
      Bronze
      Joined: 15.06.2010 Posts: 1,102
      Originally posted by EmanuelC16
      Unfortunately, your sizing is awful, it's over 3x his bet. If you want to construct a flop cbet raising range in 3bet pot you have to make it small. You could actually just click it back if you manage to think of a good range against the right opponent.
      I wanted to raise the same i would raise for protection with a strong made hand which would be 2/3 of the pot (potsized raise would be 22,25) to have maximum foldequity.

      But yeah thats expensive and i guess such raisesizes are not necessary in a 3B pot anyways because of the small STP ratio + i'm in position.
    • EmanuelC16
      EmanuelC16
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.01.2010 Posts: 13,897
      Originally posted by chocular77
      Originally posted by EmanuelC16
      Unfortunately, your sizing is awful, it's over 3x his bet. If you want to construct a flop cbet raising range in 3bet pot you have to make it small. You could actually just click it back if you manage to think of a good range against the right opponent.
      I wanted to raise the same i would raise for protection with a strong made hand which would be 2/3 of the pot (potsized raise would be 22,25) to have maximum foldequity.

      But yeah thats expensive and i guess such raisesizes are not necessary in a 3B pot anyways because of the small STP ratio + i'm in position.
      Your raise is just great for your opponent. He 3bets a lot, cbets half pot and you raise everytime you have him beat. His strategy is marvelous vs you in this case, you don't use your position at all imo.
    • chocular77
      chocular77
      Bronze
      Joined: 15.06.2010 Posts: 1,102
      Originally posted by EmanuelC16
      Your raise is just great for your opponent. He 3bets a lot, cbets half pot and you raise everytime you have him beat. His strategy is marvelous vs you in this case, you don't use your position at all imo.
      Well as you can see in this hand i not only raise him when i have him beat.

      And i'm not saying i only would raise him if i have him beat, thats board dependent.
      But on this board i wouldn't just call if i have him beat because it's too dangerous.
    • EmanuelC16
      EmanuelC16
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.01.2010 Posts: 13,897
      Originally posted by chocular77
      Originally posted by EmanuelC16
      Your raise is just great for your opponent. He 3bets a lot, cbets half pot and you raise everytime you have him beat. His strategy is marvelous vs you in this case, you don't use your position at all imo.
      Well as you can see in this hand i not only raise him when i have him beat.

      And i'm not saying i only would raise him if i have him beat, thats board dependent.
      But on this board i wouldn't just call if i have him beat because it's too dangerous.
      Monsters under the bed syndrome imo.

      Very few better hands fold here... AQ without the FD, the other AJ combos, JJ, maybe QQ if he even cbets them on this flop and that's not 100% sure. You actually are just bluffing him of a small equity part, never off a half decent hand though imo... He has lots of hands like Jxs, Qxs, 76s, etc which you are ahead of but they have eqiuty vs you and you make him fold a great equity share of the pot.

      LE: Fwiw, I think you can go without a cbet raising range in a 3bet pot 100bb deep IP.
    • Kaitz20
      Kaitz20
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.02.2007 Posts: 27,343
      Hi,

      I would sometimes 4-bet bluff with worse Ax hands, but to me AJ is strong enough to call. On that board either raise/folding or floating should be both fine options. SInce I can´t call aagin on the turn I would prefer raising myself 10.5$ which should make him fold all the air and QQ/JJ, Tx hands. Just to raise also there with KQ to balance out your bluffraises.

      best regards,