that's it, i'm done with SNGs FFS!

    • jleonra
      jleonra
      Bronze
      Joined: 04.03.2012 Posts: 53
      I just can't stand how i'm always on the wrong side of variance, i feel cheated, playing according to the strategy seems to make me lose money, and the guys who have no clue have better results than me.

      So that's it, i'm switching to cash where i can just be a nit, i guess 1bb/100 hands is better than -17% roi.



      Uploaded with ImageShack.us

      iPoker - $5.00+$0.50|<> NL - Holdem - 6 players
      Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

      BTN: 1,500.00
      SB: 1,500.00
      BB: 1,500.00
      UTG: 1,500.00
      Hero (MP): 1,500.00
      CO: 1,500.00

      SB posts SB 10.00, BB posts BB 20.00

      Pre Flop: (30.00) Hero has A:club: A:heart:

      UTG raises to 40.00, Hero raises to 100.00, fold, fold, fold, fold, UTG calls 60.00

      Flop: (230.00, 2 players) 9:heart: 2:heart: 6:heart:
      UTG bets 1,400.00, Hero calls 1,400.00

      Turn: (3030.00, 2 players) T:heart:

      River: (3030.00, 2 players) 6:spade:

      UTG shows 9:club: 9:spade: (Full House, Nines full of Sixes) (Pre 19%, Flop 66%, Turn 23%)
      Hero mucks A:club: A:heart: (Flush, Ace High) (Pre 81%, Flop 34%, Turn 77%)
      UTG wins 3,030.00


      ==============

      iPoker - $5.00+$0.50|<> NL - Holdem - 6 players
      Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

      MP: 1,050.00
      CO: 2,310.00
      BTN: 2,300.00
      SB: 980.00
      BB: 770.00
      Hero (UTG): 1,590.00

      SB posts SB 30.00, BB posts BB 60.00

      Pre Flop: (90.00) Hero has J:heart: A:diamond:

      Hero raises to 150.00, fold, fold, fold, fold, BB raises to 770.00, Hero calls 620.00

      Flop: (1570.00, 2 players) 7:diamond: Q:heart: 9:club:

      Turn: (1570.00, 2 players) 4:spade:

      River: (1570.00, 2 players) 9:diamond:

      BB shows 8:club: 4:club: (Two Pair, Nines and Fours) (Pre 38%, Flop 29%, Turn 86%)
      Hero mucks J:heart: A:diamond: (One Pair, Nines) (Pre 62%, Flop 71%, Turn 14%)
      BB wins 1,570.00

      ==========================

      iPoker - $5.00+$0.50|<> NL - Holdem - 7 players
      Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

      BTN: 1,485.00
      Hero (SB): 1,245.00
      BB: 6,385.00
      UTG: 1,755.00
      UTG+1: 1,140.00
      MP: 1,805.00
      CO: 1,185.00

      Hero posts ante 25.00, BB posts ante 25.00, UTG posts ante 25.00, UTG+1 posts ante 25.00, MP posts ante 25.00, CO posts ante 25.00, BTN posts ante 25.00, Hero posts SB 100.00, BB posts BB 200.00

      Pre Flop: (475.00) Hero has A:diamond: A:spade:

      fold, fold, fold, fold, fold, Hero raises to 1,220.00, BB calls 1,020.00

      Flop: (2615.00, 2 players) 3:heart: 9:club: 8:diamond:

      Turn: (2615.00, 2 players) 5:diamond:

      River: (2615.00, 2 players) 5:heart:

      Hero mucks A:diamond: A:spade: (Two Pair, Aces and Fives) (Pre 92%, Flop 96%, Turn 95%)
      BB shows A:club: 5:spade: (Three of a Kind, Fives) (Pre 8%, Flop 4%, Turn 5%)
      BB wins 2,615.00

      ============

      iPoker - $1.00+$0.20|<> NL - Holdem - 3 players
      Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

      Hero (SB): 1,530.00
      BB: 5,825.00
      BTN: 7,645.00

      Hero posts SB 200.00, BB posts BB 400.00

      Pre Flop: (600.00) Hero has A:spade: K:spade:

      fold, Hero raises to 1,530.00, BB calls 1,130.00

      Flop: (3060.00, 2 players) 2:diamond: 6:spade: 3:heart:

      Turn: (3060.00, 2 players) Q:spade:

      River: (3060.00, 2 players) Q:heart:

      Hero mucks A:spade: K:spade: (One Pair, Queens) (Pre 71%, Flop 17%, Turn 27%)
      BB shows A:diamond: 3:diamond: (Two Pair, Queens and Threes) (Pre 29%, Flop 83%, Turn 73%)
      BB wins 3,060.00


      This guys hits their 3 outers every freaking time, i even played against a guy who limped 68% of hands and i busted on the bubble while he was the chip leader, really using the starting hands chart is overrated, it seems playing any suited cards and every Ax,Kx,Qx would give me better results...

      Definitely SNGs is not for me, it just upset me too much when i lose 5-6 times in a row vs dominated or ATC. Once every now and then i can accept, smile say nh and move on, but this is just too much for me, i feel i'd make more money playing slots.

      Now time to start playing only cash, NL and 5CD where i've had better results, and forget sngs even exist.
  • 17 replies
    • MatejM47
      MatejM47
      Black
      Joined: 21.01.2010 Posts: 1,193
      You played less then 100 games... Thats like a bad day lol.
    • Tomaloc
      Tomaloc
      Bronze
      Joined: 17.01.2011 Posts: 6,858
      why do you think it gets better on cash, and why do you want to be a nit?

      i thought you wanted to play any suited? :D
      [edit: yes, i know you meant it for sngs - but if you want to play cash against fish you'll have your big hands cracked by these same trashy hands anyway...]
    • samson11
      samson11
      Bronze
      Joined: 26.05.2010 Posts: 18
      I think the $1.20 SNGs are terrible too, for starters the rake is so high your win rate needs to be quite high to compensate for it, and my win rate sadly has not achieved that. I think you have a better chance building your BR with cash games.
    • gadget51
      gadget51
      Bronze
      Joined: 23.06.2008 Posts: 5,622
      Hi jleonra, not a good day huh?

      I have read of a diamond player who had a 700 game downswing in one day playing hyper turbos, so try not to give up just yet!

      If you think you're playing well then there really is only analyzing different scenarios etc that will improve your game, which is hopefully the goal at the level you play. There is of course the situation where SnGs just may not be for you and that's fine to. I game them up to play cash games, but believe me, your set of Kings will get done by J3 suited just the same! :D

      Best regards,

      Mal.
    • Atoks
      Atoks
      Bronze
      Joined: 01.06.2008 Posts: 1,354
      Rome wasn't built in a day ... posting a collection of a few coolers and complaining about variance doesn't improve u in any way. Perhaps u should take ur hand posting abilities to the STT hand judging forums and get some useful advice. It'll surely do more good than moaning about how unfair life is or whatever.
    • jleonra
      jleonra
      Bronze
      Joined: 04.03.2012 Posts: 53
      Originally posted by MatejM47
      You played less then 100 games... Thats like a bad day lol.
      that's the other reason i think this are not for me, it seems i need a huge volume to overcome variance and that i can't do, i have troubles after 6 tables at the same time, on ipoker the time bank is 15 secs, not enough time to think about what's the best play.
    • jleonra
      jleonra
      Bronze
      Joined: 04.03.2012 Posts: 53
      Originally posted by Tomaloc
      why do you think it gets better on cash, and why do you want to be a nit?

      i thought you wanted to play any suited? :D
      [edit: yes, i know you meant it for sngs - but if you want to play cash against fish you'll have your big hands cracked by these same trashy hands anyway...]

      is not getting big hands cracked by trash what upset me, the frequency does. In cash games i also get owned by trash every now and then, but not as much as in sngs, not to say that in cash i'd never go broke with AJ preflop for example.
    • jleonra
      jleonra
      Bronze
      Joined: 04.03.2012 Posts: 53
      Originally posted by gadget51
      Hi jleonra, not a good day huh?

      I have read of a diamond player who had a 700 game downswing in one day playing hyper turbos, so try not to give up just yet!

      If you think you're playing well then there really is only analyzing different scenarios etc that will improve your game, which is hopefully the goal at the level you play. There is of course the situation where SnGs just may not be for you and that's fine to. I game them up to play cash games, but believe me, your set of Kings will get done by J3 suited just the same! :D

      Best regards,

      Mal.
      does it show? :f_cry:

      Actually i think i'm playing ok, maybe not exploiting some spots where i could get a way with pushing ATC, but other than that i've been using most of ICM ranges. I just lose my motivation when everything i push gets cracked by 2 and 3 outers..., i mean i never suckout 5 times in a row, hell not even twice in a row.
    • jleonra
      jleonra
      Bronze
      Joined: 04.03.2012 Posts: 53
      Originally posted by Atoks
      Rome wasn't built in a day ... posting a collection of a few coolers and complaining about variance doesn't improve u in any way. Perhaps u should take ur hand posting abilities to the STT hand judging forums and get some useful advice. It'll surely do more good than moaning about how unfair life is or whatever.

      i always do. thanks for the advice
    • Tomaloc
      Tomaloc
      Bronze
      Joined: 17.01.2011 Posts: 6,858
      Originally posted by jleonra
      is not getting big hands cracked by trash what upset me, the frequency does. In cash games i also get owned by trash every now and then, but not as much as in sngs, not to say that in cash i'd never go broke with AJ preflop for example.
      frequency? some days it just happens, you just run colder than ice then wonder if this game is for you at all... i know you know

      i play cash, and the day before yesterday i ran for -5.5 BI.
      was on the wrong side of coolers, fish outdrawing my sets all the time... and of course some spew by the end, def didn't keep my a-game :D tilt was way too clear when i shoved tp+oesd vs probable station so there i called it a day
      then yesterday i ran pretty well for +4... past friday i even ran for +5. (i know, these are not massively swingy sessions for most standards, but i usually only play at most 4 tables... so not that bad either)

      variance is everywhere, you can't run, you can't hide...
    • kurrkabin
      kurrkabin
      Bronze
      Joined: 12.10.2010 Posts: 5,976
      Originally posted by Atoks
      Rome wasn't built in a day ... posting a collection of a few coolers and complaining about variance doesn't improve u in any way. Perhaps u should take ur hand posting abilities to the STT hand judging forums and get some useful advice. It'll surely do more good than moaning about how unfair life is or whatever.


      Very solid post! Watch all the vids available for your status on the site! This will be enough to beat the micros, once you do that, start posting hands everyday you play! There will be for sure situations that you r not certain what to do. To me, building your bank with SnGs is good. MTT have a huge variance, you don't get into so many nasty spots as you will in a cash game + a mistake will cost you less compared to if you make it late in a MTT or Cash.

      Minus 17% ROI? How did you come up with that? You need thousands of games to determine your true ROI. It's up to you, but over 90% of players or so never move up the micros. I guess most of them give up early when variance hit them bad and are too afraid/lazy afterwards to move on and improve. You want to be one of them? You have to understand that variance is what keeps the fish in the game. It's variance what makes them deceptively think they are winners, because, believe me- nobody likes to lose :) You benefit from it ITLR.


      Good luck, but imo, you should try harder and harder until you make it.
    • Gerovit
      Gerovit
      Bronze
      Joined: 16.01.2011 Posts: 1,308
      Originally posted by MatejM47
      You played less then 100 games... Thats like a bad day lol.
      More like a bad 2 hours
    • Gerovit
      Gerovit
      Bronze
      Joined: 16.01.2011 Posts: 1,308
      Originally posted by kurrkabin
      Originally posted by Atoks
      Rome wasn't built in a day ... posting a collection of a few coolers and complaining about variance doesn't improve u in any way. Perhaps u should take ur hand posting abilities to the STT hand judging forums and get some useful advice. It'll surely do more good than moaning about how unfair life is or whatever.


      Very solid post! Watch all the vids available for your status on the site! This will be enough to beat the micros, once you do that, start posting hands everyday you play! There will be for sure situations that you r not certain what to do. To me, building your bank with SnGs is good. MTT have a huge variance, you don't get into so many nasty spots as you will in a cash game + a mistake will cost you less compared to if you make it late in a MTT or Cash.

      Minus 17% ROI? How did you come up with that? You need thousands of games to determine your true ROI. It's up to you, but over 90% of players or so never move up the micros. I guess most of them give up early when variance hit them bad and are too afraid/lazy afterwards to move on and improve. You want to be one of them? You have to understand that variance is what keeps the fish in the game. It's variance what makes them deceptively think they are winners, because, believe me- nobody likes to lose :) You benefit from it ITLR.


      Good luck, but imo, you should try harder and harder until you make it.
      My bro is a wise man, guru of sng's :f_grin:
    • kurrkabin
      kurrkabin
      Bronze
      Joined: 12.10.2010 Posts: 5,976
      Originally posted by Gerovit

      My bro is a wise man, guru of sng's :f_grin:

      Bro, if I ever get married one day, I want you to be my best man. Nuff said.
    • jleonra
      jleonra
      Bronze
      Joined: 04.03.2012 Posts: 53
      Originally posted by kurrkabin
      Very solid post! Watch all the vids available for your status on the site! This will be enough to beat the micros, once you do that, start posting hands everyday you play! There will be for sure situations that you r not certain what to do. To me, building your bank with SnGs is good. MTT have a huge variance, you don't get into so many nasty spots as you will in a cash game + a mistake will cost you less compared to if you make it late in a MTT or Cash.

      Minus 17% ROI? How did you come up with that? You need thousands of games to determine your true ROI. It's up to you, but over 90% of players or so never move up the micros. I guess most of them give up early when variance hit them bad and are too afraid/lazy afterwards to move on and improve. You want to be one of them? You have to understand that variance is what keeps the fish in the game. It's variance what makes them deceptively think they are winners, because, believe me- nobody likes to lose :) You benefit from it ITLR.


      Good luck, but imo, you should try harder and harder until you make it.

      well after 24h, i think i've cooled off, i'll give sngs another try but on the lowest limit, so it wont hurt when i'm -50 bi. Still i think variance is gonna make me lose my cool very often i'm afraid. :f_mad:
    • gavinonymous
      gavinonymous
      Bronze
      Joined: 18.12.2008 Posts: 1,146
      Originally posted by kurrkabin

      You have to understand that variance is what keeps the fish in the game. It's variance what makes them deceptively think they are winners, because, believe me- nobody likes to lose :) You benefit from it ITLR.

      .
      I was floored the other day when my poker illiterate gf said the same thing to me.

      I lost 40 tourneys in a row yesterday.. every possible bad beat, cooler and suckout in one afternoon. A couple of years ago this would have tilted me severely. This time I was able to keep playing through it, and managed to get back 20 or so buyins.

      I analyzed the 40 games and saw that I was making mostly correct decisions. What can you do?

      If you saw my sharkscope graph your hair would turn white. I now play with 100+ BI bankroll.
    • Vygantas82
      Vygantas82
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.04.2010 Posts: 361