Final table

    • Solovirs
      Solovirs
      Bronze
      Joined: 19.03.2009 Posts: 55
      Always wondered a few things about final tables.
      What is a better way to steal - making a 3BB or 2BB raise? From mid and late positions and from button? Every body has got 20-50BB
  • 14 replies
    • fruktpuff
      fruktpuff
      Bronze
      Joined: 24.09.2010 Posts: 3,982
      I like making it 2.1-2.3 in the later stages.
    • M0na1isa
      M0na1isa
      Bronze
      Joined: 05.02.2012 Posts: 133
      I prefer 2.1-2.3 as well.
      But got kind of a related question. Do you try to steal all the time? and by that I mean does it depend on your stack? steal with any 2?

      From my own experience what I have concluded which is working good for me so far (not sure though cause dont have enough statistics to support it) is that when I'm below average I never steal, just play premium hands. When around average, I flat call and try to steal on the flop. And when I'm deep I try with almost any 2.
    • Asaban
      Asaban
      Moderator
      Moderator
      Joined: 22.09.2006 Posts: 8,242
      In lower BI's I prefer 2,0xBB, in higher BI's I will minraise. 3BB are way too much and not up to date.

      @Monalisa:
      My steals very much depend on position. My stack isn't that important. I will steal a lot when I get first in from Button or Cutoff. A bit less from mid positions and I am kinda tight from early positions. The lower my stack, the lesser I steal. If it get's very low the range gets wider again. My lowest steal percentage hits at ~20BB.

      Regards,
      Asaban
    • M0na1isa
      M0na1isa
      Bronze
      Joined: 05.02.2012 Posts: 133
      Good tips Asaban. How about hand range? Or is there some sort of a chart? Something like with hands/BB~position.
    • Asaban
      Asaban
      Moderator
      Moderator
      Joined: 22.09.2006 Posts: 8,242
      I don't think there is a chart. The whole thing is very complex and I guess it would be very hard to press it into a chart of some kind. So many things are playing into it that it is hard to give further advice. For example you have to consider position, own stack, opponents stacks, bubble situation and overall icm situation. As you can see there are many factors one has to look at before he can decide to steal.

      If you have questions for more specific situations feel free to ask.

      Regards,
      Asaban
    • alenstrat
      alenstrat
      Bronze
      Joined: 13.03.2009 Posts: 821
      Originally posted by M0na1isa
      Good tips Asaban. How about hand range? Or is there some sort of a chart? Something like with hands/BB~position.
      Hehehe, yeah as Asaban says, you've got some MTTs to ride on to start getting an idea of all it takes to make the right decisions. Start paying attention, maybe one at a time, since initially you won't be able to track all these simultaneously :

      - Overall stack setups/ICM - who are you more or less risk averse to (you don't really want to mess with the loose big stack if you've got a big stack, you want to pick on the desperate short stack if you're short, etc.)
      - Player types - who's tight, in particular to your left - who's spewing (against who you would want to open up your range and double up)
      - Table image - ie have to been sitting around a while without playing and your raises will be respected more (by thinking players)

      There are some really good videos and articles around, can't remember if bronze members have access to them though.
    • Castle93
      Castle93
      Bronze
      Joined: 06.06.2011 Posts: 1,452
      i love 2.1x simply because players can automatically think min-raise, its weird, sometimes im just lazy though and hit the min-raise button :p
    • brobz
      brobz
      Bronze
      Joined: 22.03.2011 Posts: 569
      I find min raising dosent work well in low buy ins ppl just call because they think its weak.. throwing in those bits of extra chips somehow makes it looks stronger

      2.1-2.5x
    • Vito992
      Vito992
      Bronze
      Joined: 18.04.2012 Posts: 121
      There is actually a chart
      click


      This is for beginning. Then, with experience, you'll know what to do (according to the situation).

      2.2-2.6
    • amanofhisword
      amanofhisword
      Basic
      Joined: 10.03.2013 Posts: 41
      probably 2.5 as it achieves the same as 3bb.

      I would say try to stay away from stealing with rags as when you get called and hit bottom pair with 8 kicker or whatever you might be tempted to stay in the hand etc...

      good luck at the tables
    • Saren113
      Saren113
      Bronze
      Joined: 06.03.2009 Posts: 2,867
      Adjust to your opponents! If you got nits in blinds i would always min open close to 70%.
    • YohanN7
      YohanN7
      Bronze
      Joined: 15.06.2009 Posts: 4,086
      Originally posted by Asaban
      In lower BI's I prefer 2,0xBB, in higher BI's I will minraise.
      ...
      Regards,
      Asaban
      Do you mean 3BB total (= 2BB net raise) in lower BI tourneys?

      /Johan = :f_confused:
    • Asaban
      Asaban
      Moderator
      Moderator
      Joined: 22.09.2006 Posts: 8,242
      No :)
      I mean a minraise with a few extra chips. Something like 2,06BB.

      Regards,
      Asaban
    • roobarhalRNMD
      roobarhalRNMD
      Bronze
      Joined: 13.09.2010 Posts: 2
      like many have already said it depends.
      i nearly always min raise once the antes kick in,
      if players behind me or the blinds are peel happy i'll either tighten up or up my sizing to say 2.5 to try & deter them from just default flicking it in all the time.
      you mentioned it's a final table, i would tend to play ABC & ladder if you aren't under too much stack pressure...open up once it's 5 handed