Zoom nl10 red line and overall gameplay

    • Vycka73
      Vycka73
      Bronze
      Joined: 12.11.2010 Posts: 25
      Hello,

      As I mentioned in topic, I'm currently playing nl10 zoom. And things doesn't go in a good shape so far. After 40k hands I'm loosing @ -3bb/100. I know that my sample is worth almost nothing, especially at zoom, but still it shocked me after I realized my non-showdown winnings (a.k.a loosings).

      Here is a graph:
      http://img689.imageshack.us/img689/6530/nonsd.png

      Also I'm adding my HEM stats, maybe someone will find out my biggest leaks and will help me to fix them.
      http://img88.imageshack.us/img88/2508/reportvm.png

      Waiting for answers, thanks.

      EDIT: my image sizes are too big, and I don't know how to fix them, so I'm replacing them with url's. Sorry.
  • 12 replies
    • Tomaloc
      Tomaloc
      Bronze
      Joined: 17.01.2011 Posts: 6,858
      FR/SH...? SH i assume.

      most look pretty standard to me. :f_biggrin:
      however... your postflop aggression levels seem really darn low, and also you don't seem to be folding enough when they raise you. it's NL10, it's zoom, they WILL have it. just believe them.
    • Vycka73
      Vycka73
      Bronze
      Joined: 12.11.2010 Posts: 25
      Yes, it's SH. About aggression... After a break in poker (almost year without cash games, and returned instantly to zoom) I noticed that I started too play more passively. I think this zoom nature catched me and didn't let me go the way I played before :)
    • booomm
      booomm
      Bronze
      Joined: 22.03.2011 Posts: 677
      I am no expert in zoom, but I'll give my opinion about your stats:
      1- your 3bet% is a bit low, 6-7 is more profitable but you have to pick your spots.
      2- your fold to steal from BB and SB is too high I think, I don't know what value you should aim for but 80 is just too much, you are getting abused.
      3- your cbet% is too low too, 50 is just too low, you are missing good spots to take incontested pots, I'm taking a guess that you are not cbetting enough when you are out of position, you have to work on that, that's a big leak I think.
      overall you try to be more agressive, don't go crazy and start 3betting every 'pretty' hand, but you need to put more pressure to avoid being blown out the best hand first, and make better fold on some spots.
      but again this NL10, the better you should aim for is a flat red line, don't try crazy things!


      good luck :)
    • sileekhunt
      sileekhunt
      Bronze
      Joined: 09.06.2010 Posts: 286
      I am certainly no expert, but if you can c-bet more while keeping the same or similar c-bet success (find more decent flop spots & identify appropriate villains), you should win more.

      You can experiment with open raise sizes & cbet sizes also.
    • Vycka73
      Vycka73
      Bronze
      Joined: 12.11.2010 Posts: 25
      Originally posted by booomm
      I am no expert in zoom, but I'll give my opinion about your stats:
      1- your 3bet% is a bit low, 6-7 is more profitable but you have to pick your spots.
      2- your fold to steal from BB and SB is too high I think, I don't know what value you should aim for but 80 is just too much, you are getting abused.
      3- your cbet% is too low too, 50 is just too low, you are missing good spots to take incontested pots, I'm taking a guess that you are not cbetting enough when you are out of position, you have to work on that, that's a big leak I think.
      overall you try to be more agressive, don't go crazy and start 3betting every 'pretty' hand, but you need to put more pressure to avoid being blown out the best hand first, and make better fold on some spots.
      but again this NL10, the better you should aim for is a flat red line, don't try crazy things!


      good luck :)
      1. Yeah, I'll try to fix this. Good to know that I know how to fix this, because before break and Zoom I played with ~6% 3b.

      2. That's much worse situation. For sure, I didn't know how to play from blinds. And I think I'm loosing a lot of value in these spots. I can raise more ofc, and everything will be good in these spots, at least I believe in that for now. But problem is in calling spots. I'm scared to play OOP without iniciative, so mostly I'm choosing to fold my hands. I even didn't know how to fix those calling spots. Any ideas?

      3. This is also very bad, because even before zoom I played with 50% cbet. And this shows that I really need to improve in cbet spots. Must find some good articles or videos.

      Thanks.

      Originally posted by sileekhunt
      I am certainly no expert, but if you can c-bet more while keeping the same or similar c-bet success (find more decent flop spots & identify appropriate villains), you should win more.

      You can experiment with open raise sizes & cbet sizes also.
      Answered already in 3rd point. But yes, I really need to work harder on cbet spots.
    • iownw69
      iownw69
      Bronze
      Joined: 21.07.2010 Posts: 78
      the gap between your middle UO PFR and cutoff UO PFR is huge, I think you're too tight in EP and MP. Also opening 44,0 from SB is way too much as you will always be OOP. As I am a beginner in SH I hope someone else will tell you what the percentages should look like
    • Sholja
      Sholja
      Bronze
      Joined: 10.11.2008 Posts: 181
      Your ruver aggression is to low. Try to value bet thinly on the river specially against fishes. You are probably checking some TPGK hands on the river against fishes. Trust me, they will call with worse.
    • Vycka73
      Vycka73
      Bronze
      Joined: 12.11.2010 Posts: 25
      Originally posted by iownw69
      the gap between your middle UO PFR and cutoff UO PFR is huge, I think you're too tight in EP and MP. Also opening 44,0 from SB is way too much as you will always be OOP. As I am a beginner in SH I hope someone else will tell you what the percentages should look like
      You would be surprised how many times they fold from bb to sb raises.
    • Vycka73
      Vycka73
      Bronze
      Joined: 12.11.2010 Posts: 25
      Originally posted by Sholja
      Your ruver aggression is to low. Try to value bet thinly on the river specially against fishes. You are probably checking some TPGK hands on the river against fishes. Trust me, they will call with worse.
      Have to do this. But it's kinda hard so far to notice fishes.
    • freebsdfag
      freebsdfag
      Bronze
      Joined: 11.03.2011 Posts: 12
      I play NL10 SH Zoom and my thoughts are:

      1.
      C-betting is very profitable, especially against fish, on tons of boards. They often don't care enough to fight for the pot with the bottom of their range, because they can simply be dealt a new hand instantaneously. I'm constructing my preflop range differently than from normal ring games, to abuse this.

      I play without a HUD, and I feel I'm pretty good at noticing when I'm heads up with a fish. Generally I look for: Limping and/or not full stacked and/or donkbets.

      2.
      Versus regulars-ish players in blind vs blind situations they are so insanely aggressive that playing fit or fold is +EV against them, I believe. For instance I just analyzed this hand in Equilab:

      Holecards: 66
      Board:

      Ad5h2h Td 7c

      Villain is OOP and bets all streets ~60% pot. His range when he fires the 3rd barrel I think is:

      AA,TT,77,55,22,ATs+,A7s,A5s,A2s,KJs+,QJs,ATo+,A7o,A5o,A2o,KJo+,QJo

      Without accounting for flushdraws (which he is also barreling with a high frequency) the equity needed to make the call on the river is:

      ~35.51% and he gave me pot odds of 28.2%. Very marginal call, granted, but I just got curious because his range was so crazy polarized..
    • booomm
      booomm
      Bronze
      Joined: 22.03.2011 Posts: 677
      Originally posted by Vycka73
      ...
      2. That's much worse situation. For sure, I didn't know how to play from blinds. And I think I'm loosing a lot of value in these spots. I can raise more ofc, and everything will be good in these spots, at least I believe in that for now. But problem is in calling spots. I'm scared to play OOP without iniciative, so mostly I'm choosing to fold my hands. I even didn't know how to fix those calling spots. Any ideas?

      3. This is also very bad, because even before zoom I played with 50% cbet. And this shows that I really need to improve in cbet spots. Must find some good articles or videos.
      ....
      spots.
      2- well you should be scared of playing OOP without initiative, playing oop sucks no matter what ^^ you should narrow your calling range and widen your 3bet range, as simple as that, and add a stat for attempt to steal in your hud to be able to identify who is abusing your blinds and who will steal less often. there no specific advices I can give because I don't play zoom, but with experience you will find yourself playing more comfortable from the blinds.

      3- you don't need any articles or videos, you just analyse the board's texture everytime and take into consideration vilain's fold to cbet and overall style and you take a decision, you don't want to be firing oop like a madman everytime you raise pf but you have to put some pressure even oop.
    • FlashDavin
      FlashDavin
      Bronze
      Joined: 25.10.2011 Posts: 421
      Your overall aggression is just too low. It seems you're making the right river calls etc etc but you are much too passive. Look at how much money you lose without showdown. Try picking spots where you know the opponent is weak and put some pressure on him. I find when I'm playing my best my red line is around break even. For example, 3bet cbets in position when the guy has like 92% cbet because he is often bluffing here. Or even on an A high two suit board just float and if he doesn't continue betting, you will almost always take it from him with a bet on the turn.

      You gotta look for spots! ABC poker is fine and dandy in some situations but to really boost your win rate you need some aggression mixed in. It will also help you get paid off in the future with your monsters!

      Good luck!