I didn't understand this quiz

    • alexbrasile
      alexbrasile
      Bronze
      Joined: 03.09.2011 Posts: 11
      I got this from a quiz about value from sets:

      Stacks & Stats
      UTG ($10)
      UTG+1 ($10)
      UTG+2 ($10)
      MP ($10) TAG
      MP1 ($10)
      MP2 ($10)
      CO ($10) Calling Station
      BU ($10)
      SB ($10)
      Hero ($10)

      Preflop: Hero is BU with 5 , 5
      UTG calls $0.10, 2 folds, MP raises to $0.50, 2 folds, CO calls $0.50, Hero calls $0.50, 2 folds, UTG calls $0.50

      Flop: ($2.15) A, K, 5 (4 players)
      UTG checks, MP bets $1.50, CO calls $1.50, Hero...?

      call (3 Points)
      raise (1 Points)
      push (1 Points)


      Your answer raise (1 Points)

      You always have to ask the same questions: how do I get maximum value? Do I need to protect?

      You don't have to protect in this particular case. Hands like QJ or JT are of course possible and the opponent could be calling with a potential gutshot. You should still take the risk to just call here, though, because raising in this spot would make your hand too obvious. While the raise might not seem unattractive at first, a call here is a lot more profitable against Ax/Kx hands.

      In case you raise, there isn't really a difference between a normal raise or a push; it should be obvious that you will never fold this hand.

      Sincerely, I don't agree. If I just call, I can't get more money. If I raise, players, especially beginners tend to call with A and resist to believe they're losing and you can extract more value up to the river
  • 9 replies
    • VorpalF2F
      VorpalF2F
      Super Moderator
      Super Moderator
      Joined: 02.09.2010 Posts: 8,907
      Originally posted by alexbrasile

      Sincerely, I don't agree. If I just call, I can't get more money. If I raise, players, especially beginners tend to call with A and resist to believe they're losing and you can extract more value up to the river
      Look at the bets so far. One raiser, a bunch of callers.
      It is a bit unclear what your position is in the description.
      In the first part, it looks like Hero is the BB, but post flop, he appears to be acting last.

      You have two players who think they have a hand.

      CO is a calling station. If you raise, you drive one, possibly two players out of the hand. Why not call and see if all three come along for the ride.

      A LOT depends on who the players are.

      Why not give 'em some rope to hang themselves with?
    • ninuu
      ninuu
      Bronze
      Joined: 04.04.2010 Posts: 205
      I love sets, they are hard to be recognised by opponents. My favourite hand to have :f_cool: :f_grin:
    • ExternalUseOnly
      ExternalUseOnly
      Bronze
      Joined: 30.01.2010 Posts: 3,373
      If you raise then Ax and Kx may call but then on the turn if they check to you and you bet again what will still call? MP already led out for almost 3/4 pot with 2 players still to act by calling you give him chance to fire again on the turn, where you can make your move when they have inflated the pot and your hand is still pretty hard to read. Just my opinion but i don't play much NLHE :)

      Originally posted by ninuu
      I love sets, they are hard to be recognised by opponents. My favourite hand to have :f_cool: :f_grin:
      Nah quads ftw :s_love:
    • Friedric
      Friedric
      Bronze
      Joined: 03.01.2012 Posts: 274
      Originally posted by ExternalUseOnly Nah quads ftw :s_love:
      I'm not sure about it.

      Poker Stars, $0.02/$0.05 No Limit Hold'em Cash, 9 Players
      Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite.

      Hero (CO): $5.50 (110 bb)
      BTN: $0.53 (10.6 bb)
      SB: $5.88 (117.6 bb)
      BB: $5 (100 bb)
      UTG+1: $1.38 (27.6 bb)
      UTG+2: $5.30 (106 bb)
      MP1: $2 (40 bb)
      MP2: $5 (100 bb)
      MP3: $7.54 (150.8 bb)

      Preflop: Hero is CO with 7 7
      UTG+1 folds, UTG+2 raises to $0.20, 3 folds, Hero calls $0.20, BTN calls $0.20, SB calls $0.18, BB folds

      Flop: ($0.85) 5 7 4 (4 players)
      SB checks, UTG+2 checks, Hero bets $0.55, BTN folds, SB calls $0.55, UTG+2 folds

      Turn: ($1.95) 7 (2 players)
      SB checks, Hero bets $1, SB raises to $2, Hero calls $1

      River: ($5.95) 2 (2 players)
      SB checks, Hero bets $2.75 and is all-in, SB calls $2.75

      Results:
      $11.45 pot ($0.48 rake)
      Final Board: 5 7 4 7 2
      Hero showed 7 7 and lost (-$5.50 net)
      SB showed 8 6 and won $10.97 ($5.47 net)
    • ExternalUseOnly
      ExternalUseOnly
      Bronze
      Joined: 30.01.2010 Posts: 3,373
      :facepalm: how loud did you scream when that happened? :D
    • Friedric
      Friedric
      Bronze
      Joined: 03.01.2012 Posts: 274
      Dunno, but had to pay for new headphones :D

      I was like "oh I won another buy in, cool". And then I saw that chips are going to him...
    • alexbrasile
      alexbrasile
      Bronze
      Joined: 03.09.2011 Posts: 11
      I am saying this because once I didn't get much of the pot.
      One day I was in a live tourney and it was:

      MP 15K
      Hero-SB15K (77)
      BB - 15 K
      Blinds 75 - 150

      MP raised to 450 Hero and BB call

      Flop A72 rainbow

      Hero checks so does BB MP C-bets 750, hero calls BB folds

      Turn 3
      Hero checks, MP bets 2K, Hero raises 4k, MP calls

      River A

      Hero bets 4K MP calls


      Conclusion ? If I had checked-raised on the flop, I would have stacked the vilain and not only got this pot.
    • VorpalF2F
      VorpalF2F
      Super Moderator
      Super Moderator
      Joined: 02.09.2010 Posts: 8,907
      Here is a hand where villain played me exactly as the quiz suggests.

      NL 2 AA UTG vs passive reg

      Add that to your favourites, and see what the judge says when it is evaluated.
    • ghaleon
      ghaleon
      Black
      Joined: 17.10.2007 Posts: 5,877
      Originally posted by alexbrasile
      Conclusion ? If I had checked-raised on the flop, I would have stacked the vilain and not only got this pot.
      This is pretty different situation. In this hand I would prefer bit bigger check-raise in turn to get nice sized shove in river. E.g. turn check-raise to 5k ---> River pot would be 12850 and around 9k behind. Even as played pot in river is 10850 and you have little below 10k behind. I would assume his calling frequency would be pretty similar to shove than it is for 4k bet.

      In your quiz hand hero seems to be in BU. Position is great to have in this spot as well, because you are controlling size of the pot. When you are out of position like in your second hand that would not be the case. When you check-call flop villain might just check behind turn.

      Now when hero call flop in quiz hand pot will be at least 6.65$ and players only have 8$ behind. That will be great spot to get remaining chips in by the river. If MP continue to bet he will be pretty close to be committed to pot. If they both check it will be very easy value bet for hero. With even smallish turn bet like 2.8$ you would get less than half pot river shove spot. So in quiz hand there is no reason to be worried that slowplay would lose value.