2 spots where overcalls make my strong hands feel weak

    • FeelMeFlow
      FeelMeFlow
      Bronze
      Joined: 03.08.2012 Posts: 7
      Both these spots are a bit unusual because we see turns three handed. Not saying that this never happens but it's rarer than being hu in these spots and I think it makes a big difference in how to think about the hands.

      In the first hand both SB and BB are regs who view me as one as well. I've played with SB a fair bit and he's a solid TAG. BB is less known to me as he plays higher and we haven't played much together but he was running 31/23/16 in this session.

      I think flop is a pretty standard bet from me but the BB's overcall immediately set-off some alarm bells. On the turn things get more interesting. There's a case to be made for me pot controlling and checking here 3 handed and I'm wondering what people think about that. Obviously it's not what I went with but I think in retrospect it may be better. I'll post thoughts on the river after there's been some discussion

      Prima, $3/$6 No Limit Hold'em Cash, 6 Players
      Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite.

      CO: $634.16 (105.7 bb)
      Hero (BTN): $1,042.67 (173.8 bb)
      SB: $600 (100 bb)
      BB: $896.60 (149.4 bb)
      UTG: $2,107.31 (351.2 bb)
      MP: $451.15 (75.2 bb)

      Preflop: Hero is BTN with A 2
      3 folds, Hero raises to $12, SB calls $9, BB calls $6

      Flop: ($36) K K 7 (3 players)
      SB checks, BB checks, Hero bets $24, SB calls $24, BB calls $24

      Turn: ($108) J (3 players)
      SB checks, BB checks, Hero bets $90, SB folds, BB calls $90

      River: ($288) T (2 players)
      BB checks, Hero bets $222, BB raises to $770.60 and is all-in, Hero?


      In the second hand I'm totally lost. SB and I have played a ton together HU and 6max with the short of it being he rarely believes me. Button I don't know well but have seen around a bit and view him as a TAG.

      I could have led the flop and do sometimes but elected to c/r here. On the turn I elect to flat with the board being pretty coordinated multiway and then button comes along as well. SB is undeterred by the paired board on the river and fires away. I'm not folding but what do people like best and why?

      Prima, $2/$4 No Limit Hold'em Cash, 5 Players
      Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite.

      MP: $666.60 (166.7 bb)
      CO: $583.20 (145.8 bb)
      BTN: $490.60 (122.7 bb)
      SB: $558.40 (139.6 bb)
      Hero (BB): $418 (104.5 bb)

      Preflop: Hero is BB with 4 4
      MP folds, CO raises to $12, BTN calls $12, SB calls $10, Hero calls $8

      Flop: ($48) 8 3 4 (4 players)
      SB checks, Hero checks, CO checks, BTN checks

      Turn: ($48) 7 (4 players)
      SB bets $40, Hero calls $40, CO folds, BTN calls $40

      River: ($168) 3 (3 players)
      SB bets $115, Hero ?
  • 6 replies
    • handsomeover
      handsomeover
      Basic
      Joined: 23.02.2012 Posts: 34
      First hand considering he's a reg I don't think he will put this raise with trips...so then he has either a FH or lower flush or is bluffing, since you already have a flush the chances of him having a flush is lower... so then we are at FH or bluffing, I think he should have balls of steel to bluff here... it's rare I put him on FH. But ofcourse I can tell this story a bit different as well... Like he having a flush thinking you have 3 kings in the end it's all about the history you have with this player to determn a call or not...
    • getdotacom
      getdotacom
      Black
      Joined: 06.04.2008 Posts: 607
      In the first hand only fh villain can have is 77 IMO. Most regs don't call hands like KJ or KT from these position, they're squeezing or folding. Also I think they raise it on the flop if they have trips there, but I know, they always show hands u don't expect :)

      On the turn I like betting and can't see any point in checking. We still get value from Kx and weaker flushes. We really don't wanna see that free river at all because it could be total action killer like one more heart or Kx could get there, especially vs 2 players.

      On the river which hands do we expect villain to call ? I think he can easily fold all his Kx. So he's calling only with flushes+ because we bet 2 streets into 2 people, that's super strong. For that reason I don't mind checking it back, I think we have worst hand in our value range because we're most likely never betting other flush. Also b/f is an option and it's not even close IMO, it's a snapfold. We have all possible combos of FH's in our range and it's totally normal when we fold some portion of value range when facing a raise on the river.

      p.s. If we have multiple betsizings on this river, I think it makes more sense to bet small with this hand and it should be there.


      2nd hand - if u think he always folds all his flushes then call :) If u expect BU somehow to come along, which is unlikely, I'm always calling there.
    • DeLau
      DeLau
      Bronze
      Joined: 10.01.2009 Posts: 1,606
      I agree with getdotacom. Maybe KJs, KTs is also in his preflop calling range?
    • JPJPJP
      JPJPJP
      Basic
      Joined: 23.08.2012 Posts: 1
      What hands could he be bluffing with in hand one?

      Hand two I just call, but with your read its prolly close
    • FeelMeFlow
      FeelMeFlow
      Bronze
      Joined: 03.08.2012 Posts: 7
      Ya I think I should've bet smaller on the river and felt stupid for not doing so after

      Results:

      I folded hand one and shoved hand 2 where I lost to button's 77
    • 1mpr0x
      1mpr0x
      Platinum
      Joined: 27.11.2009 Posts: 3,404
      I think I lead flop in hand2. What bluffs and value hands do you have vs a multiway riverbet that you jam?