[NL2-NL10] NL10: A6 too small 3Bet vs minraiser

    • Avatars91
      Avatars91
      Bronze
      Joined: 18.12.2009 Posts: 2,689
      Poker Stars $10.00 No Limit Hold'em - 6 players - View hand 1875473
      DeucesCracked Poker Videos Hand History Converter

      BTN: $7.94 - VPIP: 19, PFR: 17, 3B: 0, AF: 8,0, Hands: 42
      SB: $13.62 - VPIP: 24, PFR: 16, 3B: 4, AF: 4,6, FoldTo3Bet: 50(2), Hands: 180
      Hero (BB): $12.04 - VPIP: 22, PFR: 19, 3B: 5, AF: 4,6, Hands: 57711
      UTG: $10.00 - VPIP: 11, PFR: 6, 3B: 0, AF: 1,3, Hands: 175
      MP: $8.97 - VPIP: 38, PFR: 3, 3B: 0, AF: 0,6, Hands: 96
      CO: $10.00 - VPIP: 19, PFR: 17, 3B: 3, AF: 10,0, Hands: 184

      Pre Flop: ($0.15) Hero is BB with A :heart: 6 :club:
      4 folds, SB raises to $0.20, Hero raises to $0.80, SB calls $0.60

      Flop: ($1.60) Q :spade: T :diamond: Q :diamond: (2 players)
      SB checks, Hero checks

      Turn: ($1.60) 8 :heart: (2 players)
      SB checks, Hero checks

      River: ($1.60) 6 :spade: (2 players)
      SB checks, Hero checks

      Given our stack sizes I should have 3Bet to at least 1.00$.

      As played should be fine. The flop hits his calling range a bit too well for me to cBet, I guess.
  • 8 replies
    • veriz
      veriz
      Black
      Joined: 20.07.2008 Posts: 65,504
      Hello Avatars91,

      Why would you 3bet in first place if the guy doesn't even fold to 3bets? He just calls those hands which hardly have you dominated, so from where does the profit come from?

      Best Regards.
    • Avatars91
      Avatars91
      Bronze
      Joined: 18.12.2009 Posts: 2,689
      Why do you think he is not folding to 3Bets?
      So far he has had to face only 2 situations and he didn't fold only in one of them. Is it not too small a sample size for us to declare him as a loose caller? Of course, there is the possibility that he could very well be loose since we don't have the sample size + information that can prove the opposite but as long as he is minraising from SB (sort of a weakness) and we have the added benefit of receiving information about how he reacts to 3Bets should this not be fine?
    • CPallo
      CPallo
      Bronze
      Joined: 12.04.2012 Posts: 4,343
      Why do you bother to 3-bet, if you won't even try to take the pot Post-flop? Cbet 1/2 and fold to resistance.

      I wouldn't 3 bet this pre-flop. If you know that he's weak, you could just flat call and make a plan to float.
    • veriz
      veriz
      Black
      Joined: 20.07.2008 Posts: 65,504
      Originally posted by Avatars91
      Why do you think he is not folding to 3Bets?
      So far he has had to face only 2 situations and he didn't fold only in one of them. Is it not too small a sample size for us to declare him as a loose caller? Of course, there is the possibility that he could very well be loose since we don't have the sample size + information that can prove the opposite but as long as he is minraising from SB (sort of a weakness) and we have the added benefit of receiving information about how he reacts to 3Bets should this not be fine?
      CPallo pointed it out pretty good. :) I'd be following similar plan.
    • Avatars91
      Avatars91
      Bronze
      Joined: 18.12.2009 Posts: 2,689
      1) So if I 3bet then I have to at least cBet this board?
      2) Can his minraise here not be just treated as a double limp as you have previously suggested?
      3)
      CPallo pointed it out pretty good. I'd be following similar plan.

      Similar plan in this context = calling + often floating the flop or were you specifically referring to his advice on calling being better than 3Betting? Because floating sounds a tad bit spewy without information?
    • veriz
      veriz
      Black
      Joined: 20.07.2008 Posts: 65,504
      1) So if I 3bet then I have to at least cBet this board?

      Well, why do you 3bet then in first place if you don't even CB dry boards to try to make him fold postflop? How else you going to get profit from him? Hoping to hit and then CB? :)

      2) Can his minraise here not be just treated as a double limp as you have previously suggested?

      Do you think it's the same case? :) It's totally different than normally opponents would do that -> this is a steal though and from a loose guy.

      3) Similar plan in this context = calling + often floating the flop or were you specifically referring to his advice on calling being better than 3Betting? Because floating sounds a tad bit spewy without information?

      Calling is better than 3betting and I didn't really mention much about floating. That mainly depends on boards and etc, we don't want to overplay a loose opponent.
    • Avatars91
      Avatars91
      Bronze
      Joined: 18.12.2009 Posts: 2,689
      As much as I instinctively already am a bit afraid of asking this kind of a question, but regarding treating such minraises as double-limps I just feel I have to ask this.

      Why is a squeeze/3Bet doable in the example in the link and not here?
      NL10: QJ bad turn check

      To quote you:
      You can treat those min-raises as double-limps and whatever you would usually isolate raise it up.


      + both situations are steals + from very loose guys.

      My own guess (if my thought process is correct you can simply acknowledge that and it will be enough for me, but if it is not, please, do correct me!)

      If I had to guess then I suppose this A6 hand is playability wise not all that great (we often split with even the weaker Ax hands that we dominate + we are usually getting called by dominated Ax hands, whereas QJ can still get called by worse Qx and Jx hands + we have straight potential) + here we actually have the option of playing IP and thus a call is the better option.
    • veriz
      veriz
      Black
      Joined: 20.07.2008 Posts: 65,504
      Main reason is easy and simple, you are kicking those hands out which you dominate and well proven that you don't even CB those boards which are actually the best to CB. So, I'd ask again, from where do you get value with your hand?