[NL20-NL50] [Fr] Nl50 J6 9.10.2012.

    • HansTheGreat
      HansTheGreat
      Bronze
      Joined: 14.02.2010 Posts: 3,807
      BTN: $25.07 - VPIP: 18, PFR: 18, 3B: 0, AF: 3,0, Hands: 44
      Hero (SB): $52.25 - VPIP: 21, PFR: 17, 3B: 7, AF: 5,0, Hands: 6929
      BB: $52.35 - VPIP: 9, PFR: 9, 3B: 0, AF: 0,0, Hands: 44
      UTG: $50.75 - VPIP: 14, PFR: 9, 3B: 0, AF: 0,0, Hands: 43
      UTG+1: $25.46 - VPIP: 30, PFR: 2, 3B: 0, AF: 0,9, Hands: 43
      UTG+2: $20.75 - VPIP: 19, PFR: 19, 3B: 0, AF: 1,0, Hands: 16
      MP1: $56.01 - VPIP: 11, PFR: 7, 3B: 8, AF: 1,3, Hands: 44
      MP2: $83.84 - VPIP: 21, PFR: 18, 3B: 7, AF: 7,0, Hands: 77
      CO: $17.75 - VPIP: 0, PFR: 0, 3B: 0, AF: 0,0, Hands: 25

      Pre Flop: ($0.75) Hero is SB with 6 :heart: J :heart:
      1 fold, UTG+1 calls $0.50, 1 fold, MP1 calls $0.50, 3 folds, Hero calls $0.25, BB checks

      Flop: ($2.00) J :club: J :spade: T :club: (4 players)
      Hero bets $1.50, BB folds, UTG+1 calls $1.50, MP1 calls $1.50

      Turn: ($6.50) Q :club: (3 players)
      Hero bets $3.75, UTG+1 folds, MP1 calls $3.75

      River: ($14.00) 2 :diamond: (2 players)
      Hero checks, MP1 bets $7.50, Hero folds

      Joined the pot so I could play a pot with UTG+1. Perfect opponent to bet thinly in freeplay pots
  • 7 replies
    • veriz
      veriz
      Black
      Joined: 20.07.2008 Posts: 65,504
      Hello Sikac,

      Not a best card for the turn, it may complete their FH which means we are drawing dead even. Also may complete flush, so we can't really Bet for value nor I doubt that the block-bet is going to work out very good here.

      Best Regards.
    • Avatars91
      Avatars91
      Bronze
      Joined: 18.12.2009 Posts: 2,689
      Can we still not bet the turn vs QT, Q9, KQ? It's thin, that's true but check/folding seems a bit weak given that he can definitely have a Q there, which might be betting for protection/value on the turn.
    • veriz
      veriz
      Black
      Joined: 20.07.2008 Posts: 65,504
      Originally posted by Avatars91
      Can we still not bet the turn vs QT, Q9, KQ? It's thin, that's true but check/folding seems a bit weak given that he can definitely have a Q there, which might be betting for protection/value on the turn.
      You are 3way, so you might be already against FH there. :P Plus as you see it's a freeplay pot so not that many worse hands pay you anyways. Only idea as said is a block-bet which Sikac did.
    • Avatars91
      Avatars91
      Bronze
      Joined: 18.12.2009 Posts: 2,689
      So as said as it might seem we are better off just check/folding?

      I wouldn't worry much about fullhouses as we block a lot of the JT and QJ combos and TT/JJ may be only in the openlimpers range most likely, but there are a lot of completed straights and flushes on the turn so I suppose that we indeed should just fold, I guess.
    • veriz
      veriz
      Black
      Joined: 20.07.2008 Posts: 65,504
      Originally posted by Avatars91
      So as said as it might seem we are better off just check/folding?

      I wouldn't worry much about fullhouses as we block a lot of the JT and QJ combos and TT/JJ may be only in the openlimpers range most likely, but there are a lot of completed straights and flushes on the turn so I suppose that we indeed should just fold, I guess.
      Didn't say that we are Check/Folding, we can always reevaluate the further bet sizes. Though also depend how we saw the opponents, if I am betting then I am making similar block-bet.
    • Avatars91
      Avatars91
      Bronze
      Joined: 18.12.2009 Posts: 2,689
      Didn't say that we are Check/Folding, we can always reevaluate the further bet sizes. Though also depend how we saw the opponents, if I am betting then I am making similar block-bet.


      Pretty tough to call vs any normal sized bet after checking though. We have a split with weaker Jx combos and thus the only realistic hand that we beat and that we can hope to see is a Q that bets the turn for protection.

      And blockbetting still seems very very thin vs 2 opponents. One of them can certainly have the Q, but both of our opponents sort of block each other's Qx combos so it is somewhat unlikely that both of them can have TP here. That only means that we may be happy to expect to get called by the reg with a range of only Qx or AcTx (and I think that very often his Qx and AcTx combos just isolate the fish preflop and thus are less likely postflop), and by the fish with the same range + sometimes maybe even weaker hands such as Tx, Acx gutshots, and random unlikely but theoretically possible terribly played AA and KK traps.
      The rest of their range that continues, which I believe is actually the biggest part, is already completed draws or monsters that crush us.

      1) So what about this turn plan: we check and likely fold vs any normal sized bet by the reg and we consider calling the fish's normal sized bet if he is the kind of of guy that tends to overplay all sort of TP hands by betting here.

      Although in a way I suppose it just basically means that we will very often be check folding because very often the average openlimping fish are rather passive postflop.

      I would like blockbetting, but I'm just way too concerned about the reg having a pretty strong range on the turn. I presume that he is checking back most hands that we beat anyway (perhaps not Qx) and that he is folding the majority of the weaker part of his range vs our bet. And once we check he is likely betting here almost always only with the nuts (sometimes Qx).

      We may blockbet with the idea of getting value from the fish's draws that he spiked on the turned, his Qx and even Tx hands. We can basically give up always once the reg continues and there is still value from the fish. The reg may still have a hand like Tx or even 99 that doesn't bet/call on the turn anyway + he may even have the Tc or 9c, which we want to force out of the pot and thus protect our hand.

      But an overlimping reg that calls this flop looks like a drawing reg most of the time to me.

      2) Which part of my analysis might be off and why? :f_confused:
    • veriz
      veriz
      Black
      Joined: 20.07.2008 Posts: 65,504
      Well, who said even we are going to continue with normal size Bet? We could already have reversed implied odds, we are practically just folding it. What's there so difficult? :P Don't overplay FREEPLAY!

      About the analyze I wrote practically what I was thinking, you can easily just compare to that. Also as I said both of the options are fine mate. :P Though myself I'd prefer Check and reevaluating further actions. You just wrote conclusion what we spoke earlier.