PT3 for FTP will take 2-3 weeks

    • Tarhonya
      Tarhonya
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      Joined: 18.07.2010 Posts: 694
      Quote from a pokertracker mod regarding the launch of Pokertracker 3 update for the new Full Tilt client:
      Now that the PT4 update is out a PT3 update will follow in 2-3 weeks.


      I find it disgusting that they delaying the update for PT3 just to promote PT4 because let's face it, there's no way in hell a patch would really take 2-3 weaks, especially since they already figured out how to recognize the new FTP hands and implemented it in PT4.

      I always used PT3, it's the lightest, the fastest and the most reliable from the bunch, and PT4 is nothing like it so I won't "upgrade".

      What do you think?
  • 17 replies
    • PoincaresConjecture
      PoincaresConjecture
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      Joined: 09.10.2011 Posts: 115
      + 1 wtf?!

      i would upgrade to PT4, but since a mac version isn't out either i can't even do that...
    • daun666
      daun666
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      Joined: 12.05.2010 Posts: 540
      PT4 is faster, at least for me :P
    • abhi147
      abhi147
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      Joined: 12.08.2011 Posts: 935
      I use both
      Pt4 is better in terms of organizing and post game reviewing reporting etc
      But it has shit load of bugs

      But I still love pt3 as it is so so simple
      And very few bugs

      As a result I am using both lol

      Agree it ridiculous to force people to buy pt4 but intentionally delaying update for pt3
    • tokyoaces
      tokyoaces
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      Joined: 01.04.2009 Posts: 1,883
      Originally posted by Tarhonya
      What do you think?
      I think you probably took that comment way out of context considering the update is already out ...
    • YohanN7
      YohanN7
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      Joined: 15.06.2009 Posts: 4,086
      Intentionally delay bug fix fo PT3?

      On what do you base that conclusion?

      /Johan = :f_confused:
    • buschips
      buschips
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      Joined: 25.10.2010 Posts: 13,466
      Just in case, the PT4 70% Discount for PT3-Users ist only valid until 25th november. ;)

      And its just so unfair to quote one sentence out of statement.

      Full quote from 07.11.12:
      The PT4 beta with Full Tilt support was in the pipeline for 3 weeks+ and was supposed to be released well over a week ago. Unfortunately, we had a major showstopper which took quite a while to get fixed and delayed the release by 1-1.5 weeks. It did not take us "only" a day to get this beta out -- and in fact, we had to rush it out faster than we typically like. Due to the showstopper delaying our PT4 release, it also has taken resources away from getting a PT3 release out. In addition, we have stated that PT3 will not be getting any new features and that we would only continue to support existing sites. Full Tilt is essentially a "new site" as quite a few things have changed and there was a discussion previously whether we would even support this new site in PT3. After internal discussions, we unanimously agreed that we would add support in PT3; however, it would be after PT4 and could take up to 2 weeks which we do not believe is an unreasonable amount of time. We have heard your complaints and we are trying our best to get a PT3 release out a soon as possible (faster than initially stated). I can promise you that it is not a lack of effort or interest. Best regards, Derek

      https://www.pokertracker.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=44616

      Every company would always support their new product first. And they had quite some problems with PT4 Betas and Full Tilt the first days.
      And I don´t know if you ever had to do programming, but its really hard to figure out deadlines for software-programming.

      There was an update for PT3 yesterday, for Full Tilt Support. (wow, so fast, its a conspiracy again. :D )

      Just my 2 cents
    • YohanN7
      YohanN7
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      Joined: 15.06.2009 Posts: 4,086

      ...
      And I don´t know if you ever had to do programming, but its really hard to figure out deadlines for software-programming.
      ...
      Yes it is. Also, most software businesses consist of 98% projet team leaders whose job is to ask the two or three programmers how long the fix will take (and then report to each other back and forth). The programmers are busy making these estimates.

      Another, more serious, concern I have with PT4 is that I strongly suspect code bloating. Just because it is ok for the .net based HM2 to gobble up every concievable system resource, it is not ok for a supposedly hand crafted C++ (PT3 was, at least) app to do so. Something is not well.

      /Johan = :f_confused:
    • Tarhonya
      Tarhonya
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      Joined: 18.07.2010 Posts: 694
      I don't think I took that out of context, and what I said is based on this thread:

      https://www.pokertracker.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=44615

      And yes, programming is not that easy, but if you consider they developed the new hand history recognition formula in a matter of hours for PT4 you can't just say it will take 2-3 weeks.

      That is why they already released the update, so all is cool now.
    • buschips
      buschips
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      Joined: 25.10.2010 Posts: 13,466
      You really think they did this in a couple of hours. ?(
      Full Tilt Play Money is available since 30th october. So they had at least one week on working on the FT-Support. The first PT4-Update for FT worked not really. So they had quite some problems with PT4 at the time of PT3-statement.

      And PT didn't gave me an impression of only being money-grubbing in the history.
      So maybe they just made just a honest statement at this time. ;)
    • tokyoaces
      tokyoaces
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      Joined: 01.04.2009 Posts: 1,883
      Originally posted by YohanN7
      Another, more serious, concern I have with PT4 is that I strongly suspect code bloating. Just because it is ok for the .net based HM2 to gobble up every concievable system resource, it is not ok for a supposedly hand crafted C++ (PT3 was, at least) app to do so. Something is not well.
      PT4 uses a lot less memory for me than PT3 did. Have you actually done a side-by-side using the same dataset?
    • YohanN7
      YohanN7
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      Joined: 15.06.2009 Posts: 4,086
      Nope, I have not. But PT4 is s-l-o-w. Iv'e been working professionally many years with relational database applications with equally large volumes of data, and time critical. There is no need whatsoever to have even a noticeable CPU usage with a good design and implementation. Especially since the memory usage is high. (There is an unavoidable trade-off between speed and memory.)

      I know this, and I'm not speculating. This requires a nifty middle layer between the application logic and the database that doesn't materialize itself. It should be said though that I don't know what PT4 is doing internally, but it does something sub optimally. I see that postgres is working more or less constantly. This is an indication if anything.

      I accept the fact that hardware of today is so cheap and fast that performance is no longer a serious issue.

      Overall, I like PT4.

      /Johan = :f_confused:
    • Tarhonya
      Tarhonya
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      Joined: 18.07.2010 Posts: 694
      Originally posted by tokyoaces
      PT4 uses a lot less memory for me than PT3 did. Have you actually done a side-by-side using the same dataset?
      I was about to call you silly, and to prove my point I imported my whole PT3 DB (200k hands) into PT4 and... wow! I did not see that coming, but PT4 really is lighter than PT3.

      It's not just uses less memory (although it doesn't really matter since PT4 postgresql databases are using more memory by default), it's much faster to browse stats/graphs/etc at this scale and it obviously has more features.

      On the other hand in PT4 I added a couple of stats to the Results/By Date section and it's been 10 minutes since it's "Populating..." and utilizing a 4ghz core fully.

      PS.: I still hate the layout of PT4.

      Edit: it's done, the BB/hour stat apparently separated the By Date section into 2948 months... ?(
    • YohanN7
      YohanN7
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      Joined: 15.06.2009 Posts: 4,086
      Has anybody experimented with postgres settings?

      Stuff like cache, number of idle agents, etc.

      /Johan = :f_confused:
    • abhi147
      abhi147
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      Joined: 12.08.2011 Posts: 935
      Originally posted by Tarhonya
      Originally posted by tokyoaces
      PT4 uses a lot less memory for me than PT3 did. Have you actually done a side-by-side using the same dataset?
      I was about to call you silly, and to prove my point I imported my whole PT3 DB (200k hands) into PT4 and... wow! I did not see that coming, but PT4 really is lighter than PT3.

      It's not just uses less memory (although it doesn't really matter since PT4 postgresql databases are using more memory by default), it's much faster to browse stats/graphs/etc at this scale and it obviously has more features.

      On the other hand in PT4 I added a couple of stats to the Results/By Date section and it's been 10 minutes since it's "Populating..." and utilizing a 4ghz core fully.

      PS.: I still hate the layout of PT4.

      Edit: it's done, the BB/hour stat apparently separated the By Date section into 2948 months... ?(
      PT4 is faster but there are some bugs in it
      sometimes you keep getting random errors and keep refreshing to see it

      When you ask support they say please reinstall and reimport
      It does fix some problems but not all

      I have hem 1/2 pt3/4 and personally i still find pt3 the best but misses a lot of features sousing pt4 atm
    • abhi147
      abhi147
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      Joined: 12.08.2011 Posts: 935
      Originally posted by YohanN7
      Nope, I have not. But PT4 is s-l-o-w. Iv'e been working professionally many years with relational database applications with equally large volumes of data, and time critical. There is no need whatsoever to have even a noticeable CPU usage with a good design and implementation. Especially since the memory usage is high. (There is an unavoidable trade-off between speed and memory.)

      I know this, and I'm not speculating. This requires a nifty middle layer between the application logic and the database that doesn't materialize itself. It should be said though that I don't know what PT4 is doing internally, but it does something sub optimally. I see that postgres is working more or less constantly. This is an indication if anything.

      I accept the fact that hardware of today is so cheap and fast that performance is no longer a serious issue.

      Overall, I like PT4.

      /Johan = :f_confused:
      Just a question.
      Why not use mysql instead of postgres?
      I have limited knowledge in databases but more often than not i see people using mysql over any other databases
    • Tarhonya
      Tarhonya
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      Joined: 18.07.2010 Posts: 694
      Originally posted by abhi147
      I have hem 1/2 pt3/4 and personally i still find pt3 the best but misses a lot of features sousing pt4 atm
      I'm a PT3 >>>> all kinda type, but I'm about to give in and say PT4 is better.

      Amazing how much it improved since I first dipped into the beta back in February.
    • PokerTracker
      PokerTracker
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      Joined: 07.06.2011 Posts: 644
      Originally posted by abhi147
      Originally posted by Tarhonya
      Originally posted by tokyoaces
      PT4 uses a lot less memory for me than PT3 did. Have you actually done a side-by-side using the same dataset?
      I was about to call you silly, and to prove my point I imported my whole PT3 DB (200k hands) into PT4 and... wow! I did not see that coming, but PT4 really is lighter than PT3.

      It's not just uses less memory (although it doesn't really matter since PT4 postgresql databases are using more memory by default), it's much faster to browse stats/graphs/etc at this scale and it obviously has more features.

      On the other hand in PT4 I added a couple of stats to the Results/By Date section and it's been 10 minutes since it's "Populating..." and utilizing a 4ghz core fully.

      PS.: I still hate the layout of PT4.

      Edit: it's done, the BB/hour stat apparently separated the By Date section into 2948 months... ?(
      PT4 is faster but there are some bugs in it
      sometimes you keep getting random errors and keep refreshing to see it

      When you ask support they say please reinstall and reimport
      It does fix some problems but not all

      I have hem 1/2 pt3/4 and personally i still find pt3 the best but misses a lot of features sousing pt4 atm
      At its base PT4 is much lighter than PT3, however some features can cause greater (yet still reasonable) memory usage - it depends on which functionality you are using at the time.

      BB/hour stat - please explain your issue in greater detail, I am not quite sure what you are discussing here.

      For the record, we rarely ever advise a reinstall, it is only needed when a user does not properly install in the first place. We do frequently advise upgrading to the latest code release, but that is only logical because we solve problems in each new release. In fact we actually discourage reinstalling, we find that well meaning users often make huge mistakes and can potentially damage their PostgreSQL database installation this way.
      Originally posted by abhi147
      Just a question.
      Why not use mysql instead of postgres?
      I have limited knowledge in databases but more often than not i see people using mysql over any other databases
      This very funny video gives an excellent basic explanation why we use PostgreSQ: http://www.xtranormal.com/watch/7091415/mysql-is-a-database