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[NL2-NL10] NL10 KK 175bb deep facing 5bet shove.

    • metza
      Joined: 28.01.2012 Posts: 2,220
      This is against a player who I've got 670 hands on, he's got a 7% 4bet which is a little high but not reliable over 670 hands.

      PokerStars - $0.10 NL (9 max) - Holdem - 6 players
      Hand converted by PokerTracker 3

      SB: $11.11
      BB: $7.03
      UTG: $3.45
      Hero (MP): $17.68
      CO: $17.51
      BTN: $3.70

      SB posts SB $0.05, BB posts BB $0.10

      Pre Flop: ($0.15) Hero has K:club: K:diamond:

      UTG calls $0.10, Hero raises to $0.50, CO raises to $1.50, fold, fold, fold, fold, Hero raises to $4.50, CO raises to $17.51 and is all-in, Hero calls $13.01

      Flop: ($35.27, 2 players) 6:spade: 2:heart: 6:diamond:

      Turn: ($35.27, 2 players) 9:diamond:

      River: ($35.27, 2 players) 5:spade:

      Hero shows K:club: K:diamond: (Two Pair, Kings and Sixes) (Pre 18%, Flop 8%, Turn 5%)
      CO shows A:spade: A:diamond: (Two Pair, Aces and Sixes) (Pre 82%, Flop 92%, Turn 95%)
      CO wins $33.77

      When he shoves like this my first thought is aces, but then I factor in that its 6 handed, he's in late position, and he's got position on me. It's weird to just shove aces when he can easily see a flop in position. He knows I'm gonna have AKs, QQ+, so why risk folding me off most of those hands by shoving as there's no way I'm putting in 175bb with AK or QQ which accounts for most of the combinations here.

      Long story short I managed to convince myself he had AK and didn't want to flat as he knows I'm gonna c-bet the flop and he has to give up if he doesn't hit, and thinks he can fold me off AK and QQ. It was a bizarre shove with aces but it also makes sense as most people won't 4bet/fold 45bb.

      I should have folded to the shove right? He's probably not getting in that amount with QQ/AKs so I'm up against a range of KK+ which crushes me.
      I doubt being 6 handed affects his 5bet shove range this deep.
  • 2 replies
    • BogdanPS
      Joined: 12.05.2010 Posts: 27,588
      It's hard to fold KK here but I feel that this could be a spot to raise/fold in however if you had some aggressive history/dynamics I would never fold.

      However the question I have for you: do you expect him to call with pairs, AK, AQ type hands when you 4-bet?
    • metza
      Joined: 28.01.2012 Posts: 2,220
      I don't expect him to continue against my 4bet without AK, QQ+. Don't have enough history to tell exactly how he'll play any of these 4 hands especially this deep. I believe he's folding TT-, AQ- possibly flatting JJ but irrelevant here. The two hands I expect him to 5bet shove are AK and AA as he tends to prefer flatting QQ/KK to a 4bet.

      We've had some aggressive history BU vs BB where I've 4bet him light and it went to showdown so he saw it (think it was 67s w 2 pair vs JJ or something), but not MP vs CO.

      I agree that 4bet/fold may be optimal here.