How to evolve in MTT

    • Darkyd10
      Darkyd10
      Bronze
      Joined: 08.04.2010 Posts: 1,329
      So i was thinking on how to evolve in mtts

      So far ive got somethings ill do but i would really like suggestions on anything else i could do to evolve my game FAST :p


      So heres what im doing:

      - Post interesting hands after each session
      - Do some ICM training on ICM Trainer
      - Analise each session biggest hands
      - Watch videos
      - Read Articles
      - Try to figure out what play style works best



      Anything comes into mind i could also do? That would develop my game further?
  • 7 replies
    • Wohmfg
      Wohmfg
      Silver
      Joined: 12.11.2009 Posts: 500
      I think what you've got is a great start, and will definitely improve your game quickly! Just make sure that when you are doing these things, that you fully concentrate on the task at hand. For example, when watching a video don't just let the commentator speak at you, if there is a tough spot in the video where he is going to give you his thoughts on a hand, pause the video and think what you'd do in that spot and compare it to what the high level commentator does. When you're doing ICM training, don't just snap call and snap fold certain hands, look at the stack sizes and blinds and work out what ranges you should be pushing and see if you're correct.

      So try to be as active as you can in your learning!

      Also, play A LOT! Experience is a great teacher. And combined with active learning you will improve quickly.
    • Darkyd10
      Darkyd10
      Bronze
      Joined: 08.04.2010 Posts: 1,329
      ty for the comment wohfmg

      yh i read somewhere in twoplustwo about active listening to videos

      there was a huge post about ways to fast evolve game but i lost track of it and cant find it anymore :(

      but i remember that active listening in your words :p
    • Alverine
      Alverine
      Bronze
      Joined: 31.01.2009 Posts: 1,938
      I play mtts for a living, and I would scratch ICM off the list, it doesn't have a big importance. Instead, analyze a lot of shove/call spots in chip ev.


      If you are looking for improving your game, not making money, make smaller sessions, with less tables and be active learning while playing. There is tons of std spots wich you will discover is not that std, and a lot of times you will play suboptimally. For example, analyze how you cbet every single spot. Why do you cbet, how much, what is villain's range, your perceived range and how he sees your cbet, etc etc

      Just think think think. It's a not limit game, you can bet whatever you want, whenever you want, and so is your opponents. Create opportunities for ppl to make mistakes, give a free card if that's necessary.
    • danan758
      danan758
      Silver
      Joined: 03.06.2012 Posts: 115
      I'd recommend the occasional book for when u have doubt in your plays they tend to get you back to the basics and get you back on track to your usual game but u can read the occassional page or two right now im sure it will help to some extent
    • Darkyd10
      Darkyd10
      Bronze
      Joined: 08.04.2010 Posts: 1,329
      @ Alverine

      Thanks man. Yeah ill probably start analising those spots instead of just learning plain icm, but im trying to get a grasp of the basics xD , but i understand what you say, analyse spots when the money goes in

      As for smaller sessions...is there a way to achieve good volume with less tables. Only reason i dont rl do it is because then i get no profit :( , i want to improve and i might do that during a downswing ofc

      Ive in past did some sessions like you say put 4 tables focus only on improving. Even opened tables where i was not playing just to observe...think i might do it again soon.

      About betting wherether i want, ive seen the sizings in mtt vary ALOT. Can go from cbetting 1/3 pot to full pots. Still getting used to that hehe, but i bet theres hidden tricks in there. If you can share some...xD



      @ danan.

      From time to time i use the PS basic articles re-read them to get my game back into basics. Might consider buying a book since i havent ever read one on poker, but since im always looking to improve some aspect of my game ive been going at articles like crazy more then book. One thing to consider doing next month though :P
    • Darkyd10
      Darkyd10
      Bronze
      Joined: 08.04.2010 Posts: 1,329
      Seems like i struggle in late stages past itm.

      Seem to be losing quite some chips during those phases on the way to FT...


      How would i be able to enchant those phases


      Like for early, im by default a cash player so kinda easy for me to play deepstack.

      Then push or fold its ICM and Wizard training and getting the right math decisions


      And the midway where u got 15-40bb IS HELL :(

      I normally always feel im playing too tight and loosing too much to blinds. But i cant rl open else i get shoved on by the 10-20bb stacks...

      Where u find that strategy for those phases. havent seen vids on it yet, normally they go str8 from deep to push or fold, and the mid ones go fly

      But the mid ones is where most mtts are...and vids shown always put someguy running deep like hell so hes always playing deep. Not really help :(
    • Asaban
      Asaban
      Moderator
      Moderator
      Joined: 22.09.2006 Posts: 8,575
      Hi Darkyd10 and welcome to the mtt strategy board!

      I hope you will go on with posting your questions and ideas in the future. I would be happy to assist :)

      Regarding your questions:

      I would recommend searching for a skype group where other mtt players try to improve their game by doing session reviews together, sweating each others sessions and talking about hands and strategy. Such a group is not easy to find, but if you do, you will see big improvements for sure.

      In general it's important to get input from other players since you won't realize all of your leaks by yourself.

      I would also recommend watching a lot of videos, posting hands in our hand evaluation forums and post your questions in the strategy forums.

      Books are of less importance imo. There are no "must reads" and most of the books are outdated and at the same time overpriced.

      Furthermore I can't agree with Alverine. ICM is one of the most important concepts in late game and final table play. Since this is the spot where you win or lose the most money you should obviously improve this part of your game as well. To get deep you should learn chip EV push/fold/call decisions too, of course. But you shouldn't erase ICM from your list - you should at least know the basics and practise some of them in the ICM Trainer.

      Betsizing in MTT's is quite easy. Regulars will start with 3 to 5BB in the early stages and reduce their open raising size down to 2BB when antes hit.
      Postflop the betsizing very much depends on your opponents, the board structure (dry board or lot of draws?) and of course your own hand as well as the preflop action. In most cases 40 to 60% potsize (depending on the factors above) is absolutely sufficient.

      Last but not least the late stage:
      Try to be active. Steal from late position, start restealing a lot with 15 to 25BB, try to abuse money bubbles by playing even more hands (being a bigstack).

      You may have a look at all of our mtt videos where whole tournaments are reviewed. The last one or two videos of a series are covering late game play in most cases. Some of them cover short stack play for sure.

      Hope I was able to help.
      If you have any further questions feel free to ask!

      Regards,
      Asaban