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[NL20-NL50] Against 4bets

    • felipilloo
      Joined: 26.08.2008 Posts: 236
      Hey, i know i shouldnt be posting more than 1 hand per post but ive decided to send them together to discuss a concepts..

      Hand 1:
      Villain is a 18/16, 5% 3bet, 25% 4bet and a 3.9% 4b range in almost 650 hands. Plus a had a note of this player in which he stacked against me CO vs BU with 88.

      Grabbed by Holdem Manager
      NL Holdem $0.50(BB) Replayer
      SB ($11.74)
      Hero ($61.46)
      UTG ($14.14)
      UTG+1 ($67.13)
      CO ($13.05)
      [color=red]BTN ($61.71)

      Dealt to Hero A:club: J:club:

      fold, fold, fold, BTN raises to $1, fold, Hero raises to $4.50, BTN raises to $11, Hero????

      hand 2:
      Villain is a 28/15, 3 of 3bet, 33% 4bet and 3.9 4b in 150 hands (pretty unknown)

      Grabbed by Holdem Manager
      NL Holdem $0.50(BB) Replayer
      SB ($54.82)
      Hero ($50)
      UTG ($15.78)
      UTG+1 ($22.66)
      CO ($86.17)
      BTN ($62.41)

      Dealt to Hero T:heart: T:club:

      UTG calls $0.50, fold, fold, BTN raises to $2, fold, Hero raises to $6, fold, [color=red]BTN raises to $14, Hero??

      So i think fisrt one is pretty good for 5bet or jam against this guy, second one is little tough vs unknown because his %4b is tricky, but still dont see horrible to jam vs his 4bet..

      I would like to know what is a good sample size to get a good reliable 4bet range... and once we got this which hands we can shove profitable agaisnt guys with wide 4bet ranges
  • 1 reply
    • EmanuelC16
      Joined: 02.01.2010 Posts: 13,909

      Sorry it took so long to answer. Your hands got a bit lost with the new hands coming in.

      Hand 1: Don't 3bet the hand unless he calls 3bets often or/and you can 5bet jam it. That would be a general guideline for all hands good enough to also flat unless opponent plays worse against a 3bet.

      With regards to 3bet/5bet you need to know what's the 4% made of. How often does he 4bet/fold? In general, if someone has >4% 4bet RANGE (not 4bet percentage against a 3bet) you can probably 3bet/5bet some pairs and hands like suited aces. That said, you don't win or lose much in such a spot. Players like that usually have a decent idea of this preflop game. The way to make money from them is to go postflop where they are not used to how to play. This spot and hand is decent to 3bet/5bet, it should be +EV but it might not be MaxEV.

      Hand 2: Stats matter less here. BU is isolating a limper, does he do it lighter? Does he view you as a light 3bettor against his isolations? In general I don't think you can 3bet/5bet more often here so TT will be really borderline.

      As you said, jamming TT here can't be that bad but again I am thinking whether or not it's actually MaxEV. Usually not! This is because most reg-ish looking players have a good enough idea of 3bet/4bet/5bet game you won't make more money than when pwning the postflop.