Downswing or just playing bad?

    • Aquarium
      Aquarium
      Bronze
      Joined: 22.02.2008 Posts: 14
      Cheers everyone!

      I started again on FTPoker after they reopened the software
      In less than 2 months I tripled my count and all was good!

      Sometimes ago I started to study again ICM to improve my game and after this I started losing a lot.

      I don't think my style has changed a lot just the push or old phase so I wonder can it just be a downswing or i'm just playing bad?
      Please help me to identify I'll provide all info needed

      Thx Aquarium
  • 11 replies
    • jonnyjm
      jonnyjm
      Silver
      Joined: 24.03.2008 Posts: 447
      Both.
    • Aquarium
      Aquarium
      Bronze
      Joined: 22.02.2008 Posts: 14
      LOL ok why???
    • Aquarium
      Aquarium
      Bronze
      Joined: 22.02.2008 Posts: 14
      Please can someone with experience help me?
    • Gentari
      Gentari
      Global
      Joined: 08.05.2011 Posts: 344
      Hi There,

      Do you feel you have changed anything significant in your play?

      Are the limits you play the same, style? game type?

      Have you gone too loose, ICM dictates shoves at times which are +ev but with table dynamics may not be profitable in that spot.

      Do you review hands? Post in hand evaluation forum?

      Give us an idea of what the real issues may be please.

      Good Luck
    • maythany
      maythany
      Bronze
      Joined: 18.10.2011 Posts: 1,189
      Poker is an interesting game. We can make all the right moves yet still lose and we can make all the wrong moves and be rewarded for it. So how do we know if we're playing a +EV style?
    • amanofhisword
      amanofhisword
      Basic
      Joined: 10.03.2013 Posts: 41
      Hi,

      the information you gave it is not really enough to tell if you are playing bad or just getting unlucky...

      I think you would benefit from someone who is an expert at the games you are playing to review your hand history.

      good luck at the tables
    • VorpalF2F
      VorpalF2F
      Super Moderator
      Super Moderator
      Joined: 02.09.2010 Posts: 9,091
      Originally posted by maythany
      Poker is an interesting game. We can make all the right moves yet still lose and we can make all the wrong moves and be rewarded for it. So how do we know if we're playing a +EV style?
      Time.

      No, that isn't correct.
      Hands.

      Lot's of em.

      Bet even then, as you play, you study, you learn, you adapt, you change.
      So the last 10K hands of your 100K hands is different from the first 10K hands (hopefully better) -- so you cannot really tell even then.

      The only thing you can do is:
      Play each hand as the hand demands.
      Include in your decision:
        Your cards
        Your position
        Your stack size relative to the opponents stack and to the pot.
        Your opponents perceived range.
        Action before you
        Action after you
        Your opponents stats
        Game type (cash, SnG, Double-or-Nothing, MTT etc)
        Board texture
        Odds -- including implieds

      Do NOT include:
        Emotions
        Any hand results prior to this
        How much you have won/lost that day (or any day)

      That is all that can be done.
      If you make the best decision you can in each situation and STILL LOSE, they it is luck. This WILL come your way.

      After a long enough period luck will even out, and skill will make the difference.

      The only aspect of the poker world under your control is your own skill. Build that and you will grow. Neglect it, and you will remain the same and the poker world will pass you by, grinding you to dust as they go.

      I play FL 5-Card Draw. It is a low-variance game, I am a winning player.
      Yet I lost 100BB in the space of 1000 hands one weekend.

      In the last two weeks, I have not had a losing session.
      My luck changed, but more importantly, I was forced to add several moves to my game when I moved up a limit and ran smack into better players.

      Sheesh, I MUST learn to write shorter posts,
      --VS
    • maythany
      maythany
      Bronze
      Joined: 18.10.2011 Posts: 1,189
      Originally posted by VorpalF2F
      Originally posted by maythany
      Poker is an interesting game. We can make all the right moves yet still lose and we can make all the wrong moves and be rewarded for it. So how do we know if we're playing a +EV style?
      Time.

      No, that isn't correct.
      Hands.

      Lot's of em.

      Bet even then, as you play, you study, you learn, you adapt, you change.
      So the last 10K hands of your 100K hands is different from the first 10K hands (hopefully better) -- so you cannot really tell even then.

      The only thing you can do is:
      Play each hand as the hand demands.
      Include in your decision:
        Your cards
        Your position
        Your stack size relative to the opponents stack and to the pot.
        Your opponents perceived range.
        Action before you
        Action after you
        Your opponents stats
        Game type (cash, SnG, Double-or-Nothing, MTT etc)
        Board texture
        Odds -- including implieds

      Do NOT include:
        Emotions
        Any hand results prior to this
        How much you have won/lost that day (or any day)

      That is all that can be done.
      If you make the best decision you can in each situation and STILL LOSE, they it is luck. This WILL come your way.

      After a long enough period luck will even out, and skill will make the difference.

      The only aspect of the poker world under your control is your own skill. Build that and you will grow. Neglect it, and you will remain the same and the poker world will pass you by, grinding you to dust as they go.

      I play FL 5-Card Draw. It is a low-variance game, I am a winning player.
      Yet I lost 100BB in the space of 1000 hands one weekend.

      In the last two weeks, I have not had a losing session.
      My luck changed, but more importantly, I was forced to add several moves to my game when I moved up a limit and ran smack into better players.

      Sheesh, I MUST learn to write shorter posts,
      --VS
      What would appear like the best decision to make in that situation could actually be the worst one to make. This is called manipulating the mind and Phil Ivey is a master at it.
    • gp00053
      gp00053
      Bronze
      Joined: 27.12.2010 Posts: 154
      Originally posted by Aquarium
      Cheers everyone!

      I started again on FTPoker after they reopened the software
      In less than 2 months I tripled my count and all was good!

      Sometimes ago I started to study again ICM to improve my game and after this I started losing a lot.

      I don't think my style has changed a lot just the push or old phase so I wonder can it just be a downswing or i'm just playing bad?
      Please help me to identify I'll provide all info needed

      Thx Aquarium
      Go back through your data base and select 4 or 5 hands that you lost and post them in the hand forum along with your thought process . Ask the question thoughts or downswing and everyone would be in a better position to help
    • badgerer
      badgerer
      Silver
      Joined: 29.03.2010 Posts: 555
      review your push/fold decisions using sng wizard.
    • WpgJets
      WpgJets
      Bronze
      Joined: 13.12.2011 Posts: 34
      I've had a similar experience - downturn after studying to improve my game. In my case, I was playing a little too mechanically, trying to incorporate the new knowledge into my game. It seems like it's just a normal and probably unavoidable phase/aspect of learning.