Riding a PLO rollercoaster

    • TiciBoy
      TiciBoy
      Bronze
      Joined: 13.01.2010 Posts: 1,235
      First of all, HAPPY NEW YEAR. Wish you all the best in 2013.


      My old blog died (you can find it here), because I did not put enough efford in updating it. :rolleyes: Hopefully this one will get more attention and will be little more interesting.

      After I cleared my Iron Man bonus on new FTP, I withdrew big chunk of my roll, I needed money for real life expenses (hollydays - needed to buy gifts for family and GF). As of right now I have a roll of ~$500. I'm not exactly sure how much, will check all sites and skrill and give more exact figure later.

      Because I was grinding Rush 6max NLHE for the last week of bonus, to clear it all, I got little tired of it. Few days before New Year I tried PLO. Had ~$30 on Pokerstars at that time. Opened 2 ZOOM PLO10 tables (BRM FTW), and won ~10 stacks in 1k hands. :D Sure I was running hot, but decided I'll give it a tr...

      Here is my graph for PLO (mostly it is PLO10 ZOOM. Running godlike, won most of 60/40 hands and lots of flips, but still feels good. :f_biggrin: I realize that downswing will probably hit me hard and I have to prepare for it mentally.



      What is a good winrate for PLO anyway? :)

      My goals for January:
      [+] Watch "PLO for Beginners" Video series by Huckebein(4/4)
      [] Watch "Moving up in Omaha" Video series by suitedeule(1/8)
      [] Read silver strategy articles (2/10)
      [] Play 30k hands in January
      [] Update this blog and keep it interesting and alive


      I will use 50BI BRM for micros and will adjust when I go up the limits:

      PLO10 --> $500, step down with $200
      PLO25 --> $1250, step down with $800 and rebuild
      PLO50 --> $2500, step down with $1700 and rebuild

      Or if any more experienced players have better suggestion for BRM? Any input appritiated. :)

      New blog is now officially open. Start posting!
  • 20 replies
    • TiciBoy
      TiciBoy
      Bronze
      Joined: 13.01.2010 Posts: 1,235
      Almost 500bb pot. :f_thumbsup:

      Poker Stars, $0.05/$0.10 No Limit Omaha Cash, 6 Players
      Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite.

      BTN: $3.90 (39 bb)
      SB: $9.90 (99 bb)
      Hero (BB): $18.60 (186 bb)
      UTG: $24.77 (247.7 bb)
      MP: $10.17 (101.7 bb)
      CO: $9.49 (94.9 bb)

      Preflop: Hero is BB with 5 9 6 8
      UTG calls $0.10, MP folds, CO raises to $0.45, BTN calls $0.45, SB folds, Hero calls $0.35, UTG calls $0.35

      Flop: ($1.85) 5 4 3 (4 players)
      Hero checks, UTG checks, CO checks, BTN checks

      Turn: ($1.85) 7 (4 players)
      Hero bets $1.60, UTG raises to $3.20, CO calls $3.20, BTN folds, Hero raises to $14.57, UTG raises to $24.32, CO calls $5.84 and is all-in, Hero calls $3.58 and is all-in

      River: ($47.19) 3 (3 players, 2 are all-in)

      Results:
      $47.19 pot ($1.50 rake)
      Final Board: 5 4 3 7 3
      BTN mucked and lost (-$0.45 net)
      Hero showed 5 9 6 8 and won $45.69 ($27.09 net)
      UTG showed 2 6 2 7 and lost (-$18.60 net)
      CO showed Q A A 8 and lost (-$9.49 net)
    • UPAY4DINNER
      UPAY4DINNER
      Bronze
      Joined: 27.09.2009 Posts: 21,921
      Good luck with the blog TiciBoy and best of luck plowning!
    • TiciBoy
      TiciBoy
      Bronze
      Joined: 13.01.2010 Posts: 1,235
      Meh, not going so well anymore. :D

      Down quite a lot last couple of days, I think close to 15 stacks. :f_frown:

      Will probably take a day or two off and watch some videos instead. Since I feel I was playing bad (+some runbad) it might help.
    • UPAY4DINNER
      UPAY4DINNER
      Bronze
      Joined: 27.09.2009 Posts: 21,921
      Yes, definitely a wise thing to do! A break is always a good thing when you're not playing your A game and definitely if you're starting a new game type!
    • TiciBoy
      TiciBoy
      Bronze
      Joined: 13.01.2010 Posts: 1,235
      Originally posted by HollyMichelle
      Yes, definitely a wise thing to do! A break is always a good thing when you're not playing your A game and definitely if you're starting a new game type!
      Didn't take a long break, tho. :D Watched all the "PLO for Beginners" videos, and went back to the tables. +7BI in 700 hands so far. Looks like videos helped. :f_biggrin:
    • TiciBoy
      TiciBoy
      Bronze
      Joined: 13.01.2010 Posts: 1,235
      Had a nice session. Won 7BI very quickly, but then ran little worse and came almost all the way back to BE. Took few minutes break and finished strong with +8BI. Well, PLO is swingy. :f_p:


      Favourite hand of the session:
      It must hurt to go all in on the turn with 250+bb effective stacks and have 0% equity. :f_eek: A perfect example, you should be very carefull with second nuts in PLO.

      BTN: $9.90 (99 bb)
      Hero (SB): $25.67 (256.7 bb)
      BB: $10.93 (109.3 bb)
      UTG: $13.52 (135.2 bb)
      MP: $44.37 (443.7 bb)
      CO: $40.93 (409.3 bb)

      Preflop: Hero is SB with A J 5 A
      UTG folds, MP raises to $0.25, 2 folds, Hero calls $0.20, BB folds

      Flop: ($0.60) 6 A 3 (2 players)
      Hero checks, MP bets $0.45, Hero raises to $1.77, MP calls $1.32

      Turn: ($4.14) 7 (2 players)
      Hero bets $3.55, MP raises to $8.65, Hero raises to $23.65 and is all-in, MP calls $15.00

      River: ($51.44) 2 (2 players, 1 is all-in)

      Results:
      $51.44 pot ($1.50 rake)
      Final Board: 6 A 3 7 2
      Hero showed A J 5 A and won $49.94 ($24.27 net)
      MP showed Q K 7 K and lost (-$25.67 net)
    • TiciBoy
      TiciBoy
      Bronze
      Joined: 13.01.2010 Posts: 1,235
      Didn't play much last few days.

      Funny hand...He folded his last $0.13 on the river. :D

      Hero (BTN): $10.09 (100.9 bb)
      SB: $2.61 (26.1 bb)
      BB: $3.89 (38.9 bb)
      MP: $5.90 (59 bb)
      CO: $17.21 (172.1 bb)

      Preflop: Hero is BTN with T 5 A T
      2 folds, Hero raises to $0.35, SB calls $0.30, BB folds

      Flop: ($0.80) 6 2 K (2 players)
      SB checks, Hero bets $0.53, SB calls $0.53

      Turn: ($1.86) T (2 players)
      SB checks, Hero bets $1.60, SB calls $1.60

      River: ($5.06) A (2 players)
      SB checks, Hero bets $2.41, SB folds

      Results:
      $5.06 pot ($0.23 rake)
      Final Board: 6 2 K T A
      Hero mucked T 5 A T and won $4.83 ($2.35 net)
      SB mucked and lost (-$2.48 net)
    • TiciBoy
      TiciBoy
      Bronze
      Joined: 13.01.2010 Posts: 1,235
      Have some time now, so it's time to rethink my goals a little.

      Well this one is a fail so far, not much interest in my blog... :f_cry:
      [] Update this blog and keep it interesting and alive


      Goals:
      [] Enjoy the game (don't overdo it by mindlessly grinding untill you're sick of it)
      [+] Play 30k hands in January (and don't do shots out of your BR)
      [+] Reach at least Gold status on Pokerstars in January
      [+] Watch "PLO for Beginners" Video series by Huckebein(4/4)
      [] Watch "Moving up in Omaha" Video series by suitedeule(1/8)
      [] Read PLO From Scratch srticle series (4/12) (http://en.donkr.com/Articles/Category/PLO-from-scratch!-14)
      [] At the end January withdraw 30% of my winings, including RB (if I end up in the green of course)
      [] Improve in PLO and reach PLO25 (for starters)
      [] Reach Supernova this year (this means most of my play will be on Pokerstars this year)
      [] Play other variants also, to break the monotony and widen my horizon (ocasional MTTs, SNGs, even Badugi)


      For now that will be all. If I come up with something, I'll just add it to the list.

      In the PLO series I mentioned (PLO from scratch) there is a nice BRM plan which I'll just copy here. :) It's called "50+10" rule. Basically you play a limit with 50BI. When you win additional 10BI for the next level, you take a shot. If you lose 10BI, you drop back down and grind back 10BI for the next limit.

      Bankroll Managment:
      - PLO5 to PLO10: Grind in 20 BI ($100) at PLO5 and build the roll to 50+10 BI ($350) for a shot at PLO10.
      - PLO10 to PLO25: Grind in 40 BI ($400) at PLO10 and build the roll to 50+10 BI ($750) for a shot at PLO25.
      - PLO25 to PLO50: Grind in 40 BI ($1000) at PLO25 and build the roll to 50+10 BI ($1750) for a shot at PLO50.
      - PLO50 to PLO100: Grind in 35 BI ($1750) at PLO50 and build the roll to 50+10 BI ($3500) for a shot at PLO100.
      - PLO100 to PLO200: Grind in 35 BI ($3500) at PLO100 and build the roll to 50+10 BI ($7000) for a shot at PLO200.



      I also took advantage of TCOOP deposit promo, where I get a $27 ticket to TCOOP if I deposit $100 or more. So I'll play at least one TCCOP event (probably the first one) and hope for a run of my life and a huge score - little chance of happening, but a boy can dream, right? :f_biggrin:

      That will be all for now. You are very welcome to post here. Don't be afraid, I'm just a little fish, not a shark...yet. So I don't bite. :P
    • TiciBoy
      TiciBoy
      Bronze
      Joined: 13.01.2010 Posts: 1,235
      Interesting hand yesterday. Well, what I find interesting is how low my equity was. I really thought I had closer to a flip.

      PokerStars - $0.10 PL Hi (6 max) - Omaha Hi - 5 players
      Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

      Hero (UTG): 111.9 BB
      CO: 119.9 BB
      BTN: 150.8 BB
      SB: 129.1 BB
      BB: 100.7 BB

      SB posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

      Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has K:diamond: Q:diamond: J:heart: A:heart:

      Hero raises to 3.5 BB, CO calls 3.5 BB, fold, SB raises to 15 BB, fold, Hero raises to 49.5 BB, fold, SB raises to 129.1 BB and is all-in, Hero calls 62.4 BB and is all-in

      Flop: (228.3 BB, 2 players) 5:diamond: 8:club: K:club:

      Turn: (228.3 BB, 2 players) J:club:

      River: (228.3 BB, 2 players) 6:diamond:

      SB shows A:diamond: T:heart: A:spade: K:heart: (One Pair, Aces) (Pre 69%, Flop 72%, Turn 25%)
      Hero shows K:diamond: Q:diamond: J:heart: A:heart: (Two Pair, Kings and Jacks) (Pre 31%, Flop 28%, Turn 75%)
      Hero wins 218 BB


      Let's analize it a little.

      Against a random hand:

             Equity    Wins    Ties
      MP2    61.26%  60.29%   0.98% { KdQdJhAh }
      MP3    38.74%  37.76%   0.98% { random }


      Against random AA**, KK** hands:

             Equity    Wins    Ties
      MP2    39.28%  38.60%   0.68% { KdQdJhAh }
      MP3    60.72%  60.04%   0.68% { AA**, KK** }


      Against random AA** hands:

             Equity    Wins    Ties
      MP2    34.55%  34.12%   0.42% { KdQdJhAh }
      MP3    65.45%  65.03%   0.42% { AA** }


      Against AAK* hands:

             Equity    Wins    Ties
      MP2    32.30%  30.99%   1.31% { KdQdJhAh }
      MP3    67.70%  66.39%   1.31% { AAK* }


      Against a random hand this is a monster. But his play was screaming "I have Aces". Which only gives us 35% if he has random AA**. With every broadway along his aces, we lose equity.

      This just shows how PLO can be confusing to a beginner. A hand that looks like a monster might not be just that against some hands. And this was clearly the case in this hand. Even if we look our equity against a range. What kind of hands do people 3bet at micro stakes PLO? Aces! Most of all 3bets are AA** hands.

      As I look back at how I played, it would be better to just call his 3bet and play postflop, since my hand has great playability.
    • Jitroceler
      Jitroceler
      Bronze
      Joined: 28.05.2010 Posts: 217
      Hi,

      playing 10PLO ZOOM on Stars myself. I wish you the best luck and will follow your blog.

      Just my 2 cents on AKQJss hand. I really think that on this limit is much better to see the flop with this hand and not go broke PF. Too many players are 3betting AAxx oop and with 3rd guy interested you can get much more with your hand on the flop, where you can make some nuts hands. Also many players are making huge mistakes in postflop play, so no need to make xbet wars preflop on PLO10 I think.

      Hope it makes sense through my english skill :) .

      Edit: Lol, now I can see that you have almost the same thought under the hand. Sorry for spamming :)
    • TiciBoy
      TiciBoy
      Bronze
      Joined: 13.01.2010 Posts: 1,235
      Originally posted by Jitroceler
      Hi,

      playing 10PLO ZOOM on Stars myself. I wish you the best luck and will follow your blog.

      Just my 2 cents on AKQJss hand. I really think that on this limit is much better to see the flop with this hand and not go broke PF. Too many players are 3betting AAxx oop and with 3rd guy interested you can get much more with your hand on the flop, where you can make some nuts hands. Also many players are making huge mistakes in postflop play, so no need to make xbet wars preflop on PLO10 I think.

      Hope it makes sense through my english skill :) .

      Edit: Lol, now I can see that you have almost the same thought under the hand. Sorry for spamming :)
      Hi,

      yes I came to the same conclusion. :) But it is always good to see other players' thoughts, even if they are the same. ;)

      Recently I don't play ZOOM anymore and usually open 9 regular tables. Will play both and see what I like more as I put in some more hands.

      GL with your game!
    • TiciBoy
      TiciBoy
      Bronze
      Joined: 13.01.2010 Posts: 1,235
      Wow, PLO is a rollercoaster. :D And like rollercoasters it's fun. :f_cool:



      It can get frustating, but I still like it a lot so far. Not my results, tho...

      Played little over 30k hands this month, and am down a couple of BIs. And that is by running 15BI above EV. I did not expect that but still I know I can improve and turn it around. I still have big enough roll for PLO10, so I'm not dropping down unles I hit $250 mark. I don't think PLO10 is much harder to play than PLO5 if we look at the quality of opponents.

      I'm reading PLO from scratch series and I must say it's really helpfull. It starts with the basics and explains everything well enough for even a beginner to understand.
    • yarish
      yarish
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.02.2011 Posts: 1,375
      Hello. Would you be so kind and write what is your rake paid in PLO10 zoom?
      Thanks in advance.
    • Kyyberi
      Kyyberi
      Coach
      Coach
      Joined: 09.07.2010 Posts: 10,507
      When riding a roller coaster, you need to have safety belt (BRM) on. :)

      Good luck with the ride!
    • TiciBoy
      TiciBoy
      Bronze
      Joined: 13.01.2010 Posts: 1,235
      Originally posted by Kyyberi
      When riding a roller coaster, you need to have safety belt (BRM) on. :)

      Good luck with the ride!
      So true. :)
      I do keep to BRM. What do you think about that 50+10 rule? Is it OK in your oppinion for climbing the stakes? Once I get higher, I'll keep more BIs for sure.
    • TiciBoy
      TiciBoy
      Bronze
      Joined: 13.01.2010 Posts: 1,235
      Originally posted by yarish
      Hello. Would you be so kind and write what is your rake paid in PLO10 zoom?
      Thanks in advance.
      So far I played 35,996 hands and payed $340,25 in rake. That's $0,94/100 or 9,4bb/100 hands.

      EDIT: Just realized that's 33BI for the hands I've played. :f_eek: Fcking rake. :f_mad:
    • Kyyberi
      Kyyberi
      Coach
      Coach
      Joined: 09.07.2010 Posts: 10,507
      10bb/100 is very small rake. I have paid 40bb/100 in PLO10 at Ongame.

      There are 2 types of requirements for BRM. Mathematical and psychological. And they both depend on your ability to deposit more if needed.
    • TiciBoy
      TiciBoy
      Bronze
      Joined: 13.01.2010 Posts: 1,235
      Originally posted by Kyyberi
      10bb/100 is very small rake. I have paid 40bb/100 in PLO10 at Ongame.

      There are 2 types of requirements for BRM. Mathematical and psychological. And they both depend on your ability to deposit more if needed.
      WOw, 40bb/100 is sick. You need to be a fcking master of PLO to win there. :f_o:
    • yarish
      yarish
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.02.2011 Posts: 1,375
      How is it going?
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