[NL2-NL10] 3 bet bluff vs UTG reg

    • DrDunne
      DrDunne
      Bronze
      Joined: 29.12.2010 Posts: 3,378
      Partyboy, $0.05/$0.10 No Limit Hold'em Cash, 6 Players
      Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite.

      CO: $9.98 (99.8 bb)
      Hero (MP): $10.52 (105.2 bb)
      SB: $10.33 (103.3 bb)
      BTN: $11.34 (113.4 bb)
      BB: $26.55 (265.5 bb)
      UTG: $12.46 (124.6 bb)

      Preflop: Hero is MP with K :diamond: Q :spade:
      UTG raises to $0.30, hero???

      i've been thinking recently about this situation and i'm not exactly sure about it so i created a sample hand :D

      villain is 20/18 reg over 400 hands, folds to 3bet 75% and opens from UTG 13%.

      generally vs this sort of player i'd be flatting IP with AK and QQ because a lot of the time if they continue i'm not doing well. that also means i'm 3betting KK and AA only. should i have a bluff range here? if so then i was thinking it would be best to pick a hand like KQ since i can't really call an open with it and it's at the top of my folding range and it blocks QQ/KK and AK. or is it not a good idea to have a 3bet bluff range vs a UTG open?

      also, what about different positions at the table? because obviously it's not such a good idea if there are whales behind us since they will cold call our 3bet bluff and UTG will be in a fun spot. but if i were on the BU for example should i be more inclined to 3bet bluff or does it not make a difference?
  • 8 replies
    • kymupa
      kymupa
      Bronze
      Joined: 22.10.2009 Posts: 22,364
      Hello,

      Yeah, you can just add this to your 3bet bluff range and it's a quite good hand, since we block the top of his range.

      I don't think that positions are quite important here.
      When we are MP our 3bet looks a lot stronger, but then on the other hand, there's a bigger probability for someone to have KK+ after us than being at BU.

      Best,
      Plamen
    • DrDunne
      DrDunne
      Bronze
      Joined: 29.12.2010 Posts: 3,378
      interesting.. it's something i never really considered. i know balance isn't really gunna be important but the reason why i say KQo as an example is because it would mean i have 12 value and 12 bluff combos. would you suggest any other hands like AJ or will that mean we start 3betting too much vs a strong range?
    • w34z3l
      w34z3l
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      Joined: 03.08.2009 Posts: 13,330
      • 13.01.2013, 17:57
      • This post has been edited 2 time(s), it was last edited by w34z3l: 13.01.2013 17:58.
      Just to add my 2cents.

      It's a solid play that is underutilised at micro-stakes.

      I would expect it to show a slightly higher profit in later positions, statistically smaller chance of someone waking up with AA,KK etc.

      I recommend you only use it against regulars. Weaker players don't understand your 3bet ranges are stronger in these positions and will continue vs your 3bet more often seeing as they may well be opening tighter from UTG.

      Oh, and assuming UTG was opening really wide and you could profitably flat, you would obviously choose to do so, and bluff with a weaker hand instead.
    • DrDunne
      DrDunne
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      Joined: 29.12.2010 Posts: 3,378
      cool! ty
    • w34z3l
      w34z3l
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      Joined: 03.08.2009 Posts: 13,330
      Originally posted by DrDunne
      interesting.. it's something i never really considered. i know balance isn't really gunna be important but the reason why i say KQo as an example is because it would mean i have 12 value and 12 bluff combos. would you suggest any other hands like AJ or will that mean we start 3betting too much vs a strong range?
      Btw, at microstakes ----> if I'm UTG and you are MP with 27o, I guarantee you will make a profit until I figure out what you are doing. You may as well bluff with the top of your range that is too weak to call though and muck the 27o. But theoretically you will make instant profit in these situations with 2 blank cards. (Against a good regular).
    • DrDunne
      DrDunne
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      Joined: 29.12.2010 Posts: 3,378
      Originally posted by w34z3l
      Originally posted by DrDunne
      interesting.. it's something i never really considered. i know balance isn't really gunna be important but the reason why i say KQo as an example is because it would mean i have 12 value and 12 bluff combos. would you suggest any other hands like AJ or will that mean we start 3betting too much vs a strong range?


      Btw, at microstakes ----> if I'm UTG and you are MP with 27o, I guarantee you will make a profit until I figure out what you are doing. You may as well bluff with the top of your range that is too weak to call though and muck the 27o. But theoretically you will make instant profit in these situations with 2 blank cards. (Against a good regular).
      yeah it makes sense but obviously wouldn't be using the 72o :D i know we can get away with a lot of 3bets and i tend to use hands like A2s-A5s and some SCs as well as some Kxs as a bluff IP (for example when i'm otb vs a CO open) and it works really well but i don't think i'd be using these sorts of hands vs a UTG open because i'd want to use the blockers to just give myself a better chance. am i on the right lines with that?
    • w34z3l
      w34z3l
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      Joined: 03.08.2009 Posts: 13,330
      • 13.01.2013, 18:29
      • This post has been edited 1 time(s), it was last edited by w34z3l: 13.01.2013 18:35.
      Originally posted by DrDunne
      I tend to use hands like A2s-A5s and some SCs as well as some Kxs as a bluff IP (for example when i'm otb vs a CO open) and it works really well but i don't think i'd be using these sorts of hands vs a UTG open because i'd want to use the blockers to just give myself a better chance. am i on the right lines with that?
      A2-A5 all have blockers and Kxs all have blockers. I suppose you could wait for 2 blockers, like AJ, QK type stuff if that's what you mean.

      The most important thing making this play is selecting the right opponent. You want a thinking reg who will lay down hands like AQ/QQ etc.

      But there is no reason why you wouldn't use A5s etc. Check the Ft3bet stat also first. (Some regulars fold less than others.) But there are plenty of regulars at micros who fold 80%+ to 3bets. Even if they are opening a tight range UTG you can generate insta-profit with a 3bet bluff.
    • kymupa
      kymupa
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      Joined: 22.10.2009 Posts: 22,364
      Regulars on microstakes usually tend to fold a lot against 3bet when they are UTG, but of course you can always find someone that does not.

      I like w34z3l's advice to only do it against players that basically fold a lot to 3bet, and basically against players against who calling KQo won't be a good idea at all.