[NL20-NL50] 50fr 88 SB

    • AtrociousNightmare
      AtrociousNightmare
      Bronze
      Joined: 14.04.2010 Posts: 1,185
      Poker Stars, $0.25/$0.50 No Limit Hold'em Cash, 9 Players
      Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite.

      MP3: $37.54 (75.1 bb)
      CO: $53.62 (107.2 bb)
      BTN: $101.92 (203.8 bb)
      Hero (SB): $53.66 (107.3 bb)
      BB: $43.74 (87.5 bb)
      UTG+1: $57.02 (114 bb)
      UTG+2: $22.89 (45.8 bb)
      MP1: $86.57 (173.1 bb)
      MP2: $37.25 (74.5 bb)

      Preflop: Hero is SB with 8 8
      UTG+2 posts BB OOP, UTG+1 folds, UTG+2 raises to $1.25, 2 folds, MP3 calls $1.25, 2 folds, Hero calls $1, BB folds

      Flop: ($4.25) 8 J A (3 players)
      Hero checks, UTG+2 checks, MP3 bets $1.50, Hero raises to $4.50, UTG+2 folds, MP3 calls $3

      Turn: ($13.25) 7 (2 players)
      Hero bets $6.27, MP3 calls $6.27

      River: ($25.79) Q (2 players)
      Hero bets $12.19, MP3 calls $12.19

      Results:
      $50.17 pot ($2.75 rake)
      Final Board: 8 J A 7 Q
      MP3 showed 4 9 and won $47.42 ($23.21 net)
      Hero showed 8 8 and lost (-$24.21 net)

      VPIP: 55, PFR: 24, 3B: 7, AF: 1,1, Hands: 78

      Nevermind my bad raise sizing on flop (at that moment I got "scared" of pushing him out, silly me), that is a mistake.

      But what do you think of turn and river?
      I kept betting for value because I thought a player like him wouldn't fold any A, or even high J like KJ, QJ etc...
      And would show me at some point if he had a flush.

      He didn't.
  • 5 replies
    • EmanuelC16
      EmanuelC16
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.01.2010 Posts: 13,909
      Heya,

      Yes, flop is obviously a bigger raise.. more around 5.50 imo. Though I prefer leading there for pot with 2players to act, I think check/raise gets you too little action.

      Turn is such a small bet.. he calls any pair + heart, just bet 10 and shove good rivers imo. You don't want to not get his stack on decent runouts, you just miss so much value vs his AT, AQ, AK, KJ, etc.
    • AtrociousNightmare
      AtrociousNightmare
      Bronze
      Joined: 14.04.2010 Posts: 1,185
      Originally posted by EmanuelC16
      Heya,

      Yes, flop is obviously a bigger raise.. more around 5.50 imo. Though I prefer leading there for pot with 2players to act, I think check/raise gets you too little action.

      Turn is such a small bet.. he calls any pair + heart, just bet 10 and shove good rivers imo. You don't want to not get his stack on decent runouts, you just miss so much value vs his AT, AQ, AK, KJ, etc.
      I thought of check/raising because PF UTG was very loose, (57/43 but I had only 7 hands), so I thought on a A high board of this kind he basically always CBets, and I obviously was wrong.
      However I'm not a fan of donk bets that much against passive players as they just call you with anything and you just have to hope they have a worse hand.
      With a check/raise they often overplay (or overcall) stuff, so I thought it was still a better alternative. (again don't ask me about the terrible raise :f_cry: )
      But my assumption on UTG was bad and I wasn't expecting MP3 to get initiative anyway.

      On the turn I bet small because usually passive players like MP3 when they get initiative and they have an A in this case with a FD around, they like to bet BIG.
      So I immediately thought him on a FD or SD like T9, both of which closed on turn.
      Therefore I just went low profile and see if he raised, he didn't.
      The Q however was yet another dangerous card, so I just went for 1/2 value.

      My read was right but probably my play wasn't.
    • EmanuelC16
      EmanuelC16
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.01.2010 Posts: 13,909
      You already account for the worse hands that call when you bet 10 on the turn, no reason to bet smaller to look weaker.. You check/raise flop and bet turn, there's no way to really look weak, you just miss value from the hands you, youself said he randomly calls with on the flop. If he calls any Ax, he probably has QT, KQ in his range as well. He can have Jx with clubs like JTcc with plenty of backdoor draws. It does not make any sense at all to bet small unless you have a dynamic that induces raises from weak hands.
    • AtrociousNightmare
      AtrociousNightmare
      Bronze
      Joined: 14.04.2010 Posts: 1,185
      Originally posted by EmanuelC16
      You already account for the worse hands that call when you bet 10 on the turn, no reason to bet smaller to look weaker.. You check/raise flop and bet turn, there's no way to really look weak, you just miss value from the hands you, youself said he randomly calls with on the flop. If he calls any Ax, he probably has QT, KQ in his range as well. He can have Jx with clubs like JTcc with plenty of backdoor draws. It does not make any sense at all to bet small unless you have a dynamic that induces raises from weak hands.
      It's not to look weaker.
      It's basically "I don't know how much should I stick to my read, so I'm gonna do a compromise and bet small to lose less in case I'm right".
      But as I said, even though my read could be right, I can't play like I did.

      If I really am 100% certain of my read, then I should check/fold.
      If not 100% certain (obviously it's almost never 100%, especially here) then I should simply play standard (in this case betting big) and use my read to protect myself against a raise.
      But against his stack I doubt I would be able to fold.
      If he does it on the turn, I still have outs against whatever he has and I'm still not sure if he's ahead, probably not.
      If he does it on the river because somehow I didn't reach shoving size, it means that I have to add just a few bucks in a huge pot.
      So...
      :D
    • EmanuelC16
      EmanuelC16
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.01.2010 Posts: 13,909
      You aren't commited on river if you know for sure he only raises better because there are no more cards to come you can split his range in better or worse. There needs to be some worse in order to call even with pretty good odds while on the turn you have equity to draw out so you can 'suckout' on some of the better, therefore you don't need as many worse hands to raise like on the river.