Am i unlucky or just a bad player?

    • bro89
      bro89
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.05.2008 Posts: 11
      Hello i would like to get some input on this hand that i have played because i am not shore if it is me being unlucky or if i actually suck because i seem to run in to simular situations like this al the time and i think its these situations that makes me a losing player instead of a winning one.


      the first hand is:

      Hand converted with online PokerStrategy.com hand converter:

      Play hand

      $0.02/$0.04 No-Limit Hold'em (5 handed)

      Known players:
      BU:
      $11.23
      SB:
      $4.00
      BB (Hero):
      $4.58
      MP3:
      $5.65
      CO:
      $9.84


      Preflop: Hero is BB with K, A.
      MP3 raises to $0.12, CO folds, BU calls $0.12, SB folds, Hero raises to $0.20, MP3 calls $0.08, BU calls $0.08.

      Flop: ($0.62) A, 8, 2 (3 players)
      Hero bets $0.62, MP3 calls $0.62, BU raises to $2.00, Hero calls $1.38, MP3 calls $1.38.

      Turn: ($6.62) T (3 players)
      Hero bets $2.38, MP3 raises to $3.45(All-In), BU calls $3.45.

      River: ($15.9) 4 (3 players)


      Final Pot: $15.9.
      Results follow:

      BU shows a pair of aces(Q A).
      Hero shows a pair of aces(K A).

      Hero wins with a pair of aces(K A).

      and the second one is:

      Hand converted with online PokerStrategy.com hand converter:

      Play hand

      $0.02/$0.04 No-Limit Hold'em (6 handed)

      Known players:
      BU:
      $1.04
      SB:
      $6.03
      BB:
      $3.02
      MP2 (Hero):
      $4.94
      MP3:
      $3.83
      CO:
      $6.35


      Preflop: Hero is MP2 with A, Q.
      Hero raises to $0.14, 4 folds, BB calls $0.10.

      Flop: ($0.3) 9, 3, T (2 players)
      BB checks, Hero checks.

      Turn: ($0.3) A (2 players)
      BB checks, Hero bets $0.32, BB raises to $0.84, Hero calls $0.52.

      River: ($1.98) 6 (2 players)
      BB checks, Hero bets $1.98, BB raises to $2.04(All-In), Hero calls $0.06.

      Final Pot: $6.06.



      So what do you guys think about these two hands ? and lets assume that we dont have a read on any of our opponents. should i understand that i am beat in these situations and therefore fold?
  • 12 replies
    • Rihard4a
      Rihard4a
      Bronze
      Joined: 08.09.2010 Posts: 2,064
      Don't play your Top Pair hands as the nuts. Because most of the time they are not and you gonna throw away money. Play for stacks only with the monsters.
    • bro89
      bro89
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.05.2008 Posts: 11
      A simple and good answer!

      thanks
    • yougotfelted51
      yougotfelted51
      Gold
      Joined: 04.02.2010 Posts: 1,276
      unless you have reads that villain will call down big bets light, i would be more inclined to bet 2/3 - 3/4 pot. this will allow villain to call/raise with a wider range of hands.

      betting pot will likely cause villain to continue only with a strong range of hands
    • JCSeerup
      JCSeerup
      Bronze
      Joined: 14.12.2010 Posts: 1,094
      Hand 1: Bet bigger PF, cbet smaller, 2/3-3/4 pot should be better imo. On the turn I would probably check to induce more agg. from him with random aces and call an all-in, since I think we can beat most of his range here.

      Hand 2: PF seems fine, not cbetting is fine on such a wet board. The betsizing on the turn is a bit to big imo I would go with 2/3 pot, since it just look too strong with full pot, so we scare away all worse hands. On the river I would just try to get to a cheap showdown if possible, def not going all-in.
    • ihufa
      ihufa
      Gold
      Joined: 18.03.2008 Posts: 3,323
      I think the answer is the latter
    • booomm
      booomm
      Bronze
      Joined: 22.03.2011 Posts: 677
      you are overplaying top pair, that's a leak. aside from that, you can't just judge how good/bad you are playing based on 2 hands, or even 10k. play a significant volume then try to review your game.
    • nefarious26
      nefarious26
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.11.2008 Posts: 413
      to say hes overplaying tptk or gk at this stake is just lol. to even think about folding these hands without firm reads is a serious leak imo
    • Th334
      Th334
      Bronze
      Joined: 26.11.2012 Posts: 971
      Often after a raise our TP becomes a mere bluff-catcher. What we don't want to do with bluff-catchers is donking the next street after we called a raise. It makes no sense in most cases.

      Originally posted by nefarious26
      to say hes overplaying tptk or gk at this stake is just lol. to even think about folding these hands without firm reads is a serious leak imo
      To your surprise, even at these limits people still have better hands than TPGK from time to time. I know it's hard to believe, but the chance of your opponent having 2P+ has nothing to do with the limit :s_o:
    • Rihard4a
      Rihard4a
      Bronze
      Joined: 08.09.2010 Posts: 2,064
      Originally posted by JCSeerup
      Hand 1: Bet bigger PF, cbet smaller, 2/3-3/4 pot should be better imo. On the turn I would probably check to induce more agg. from him with random aces and call an all-in, since I think we can beat most of his range here.

    • arthurbentley
      arthurbentley
      Silver
      Joined: 12.10.2010 Posts: 252
      Originally posted by booomm
      you are overplaying top pair, that's a leak. aside from that, you can't just judge how good/bad you are playing based on 2 hands, or even 10k. play a significant volume then try to review your game.
      I am new to cash game. But I have quickly realised that playing TPTK on the flop, as if it were the nuts, by stacking off, is a big leak. (At least for me it is.) I am used to SNGs and often check raise TPTK on the flop. Obviously, the stacks are much bigger in cash game, and I now realise, after getting stung a few times by trips, that check raising TPTK on flop is a recipe for financial ruin. Unless the opponent is a calling station, tread with caution is my recommendation and try to control the size of the pot.

      I have now decided to play TPTK on flop by value betting first, and leave check raising for monster holdings, such as trips, or top two pair on flop.

      bro89 should not have min-raised pre-flop however. He should have made a proper 3-bet. So his opponents don't have the implied odds for set mining. Even I know that! :D

      I have noticed that if a tight player just flat calls a raise pre-flop, and re-raises on the flop with an Ace on board, while I am holding TPTK, he has trips. Which makes sense really. If he had Ace King he would likely 3-bet my raise pre-flop, and flat if he was holding a small pair.
    • nefarious26
      nefarious26
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.11.2008 Posts: 413
      Originally posted by Th334
      Often after a raise our TP becomes a mere bluff-catcher. What we don't want to do with bluff-catchers is donking the next street after we called a raise. It makes no sense in most cases.

      Originally posted by nefarious26
      to say hes overplaying tptk or gk at this stake is just lol. to even think about folding these hands without firm reads is a serious leak imo
      To your surprise, even at these limits people still have better hands than TPGK from time to time. I know it's hard to believe, but the chance of your opponent having 2P+ has nothing to do with the limit :s_o:
      you are 100% correct

      but well over over 50% of the time they will have worse so yeah you will value town yourself sometimes
    • nefarious26
      nefarious26
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.11.2008 Posts: 413
      im not saying op has played these hands well,,,far from it, but when they raise you its not always the nuts, they raise for info alot and overplay weak hands to death, if you know the guy is super passive then yeah its easy dump