[NL2-NL10] A5o nl4

    • ilidek
      ilidek
      Bronze
      Joined: 06.07.2010 Posts: 2,952
      UTG: $5 (125 bb)
      MP: $4.26 (106.5 bb)
      CO: $4.32 (108 bb)
      Hero (BTN): $4 (100 bb)
      SB: $3.74 (93.5 bb)
      BB: $7.55 (188.8 bb)

      Preflop: Hero is BTN with A:heart: 5:diamond:
      3 folds, Hero raises to $0.10, SB folds, BB calls $0.06

      Flop: ($0.22) 5:heart: 7:spade: 6:club: (2 players)
      BB checks, Hero bets $0.14, BB calls $0.14

      Turn: ($0.50) 5:club: (2 players)
      BB checks, Hero checks

      River: ($0.50) 9:heart: (2 players)
      BB checks, Hero bets $0.30, BB calls $0.30

      I think my trips has 2 streets of value on this board. I am not afraid of too many cards, I don't want to get raise. What do you think about it? xb and C is better or worse than b/f and why
  • 7 replies
    • BogdanPS
      BogdanPS
      Basic
      Joined: 12.05.2010 Posts: 27,588
      Hi Ilidek,

      Preflop: looks fine

      Postflop: Cbetting the flop to take it down and as a thin valuebet is fine.

      On the turn I think it's a huge mistake to not bet.

      Don't forget the dry card this 5 is and how all pairs, overpairs and draws can still call.

      You are losing a TON of value from hands that:
      A) won't call a bet on river (missed draws)
      B) pairs that can call turn and river or may not call river because of scare card.

      So bet this turn 100% of the time. I'd make 0.35-0.45 or so.

      This is a perfect example of missed value in a pot at the micros.
    • ilidek
      ilidek
      Bronze
      Joined: 06.07.2010 Posts: 2,952
      I did some notes from your hand evaluation to my warm ups. I would be very grateful if you could check it:


      987r w/ 97 b/f because:
      1)there isn’t any FD we beat (we have ~75% equity vs FD)
      2) his range = sets, two pairs (with very small implied odds when we get our str8)
      3) made str8 some better some worse but still
      4) we have only 8 outs and with half of them we still can lose

      658tt w/ JJ b/3b because:
      1)QQ+ usually would 3b preflop (CO+)
      and his range is probably something like:
      MP2 56.31% 55.38% 0.93% JdJc
      MP3 43.69% 42.75% 0.93% TT-55, A8s, 98s, 87s, 65s, AdQd, KdQd, AdTd, KdTd, QdTd, JdTd, Ad9d

      shove vs short/midstack w/ TT, JJ even in our best case scenario won’t be super profitable

      fish:
      1) d w/ FD sometimes w/ TP or second pair(PP) (note)
      2) shorter (can play cc/cc) so we want to 3b for value mainly. w/ TPDK b/b/xb he would play x/c x/c w/ PP, draws etc. We will have more value from it.(wo/ notes)
      576r5 w/A5 b/b because:
      1) missed draws won’t call river
      2) scary card may scare away PP
      3) we beat PP
      4) if our opponent has str8 he usually just raise

      Things to improve:
      1) Make more notes, create your own system of notes and do them regularly
      2) Bet more often T. You miss TON of value for not second barreling.
      3) Without notes don’t assume someone will bluff bet on R.
      4) push TT+ vs mid/short won’t be a super profitable
    • BogdanPS
      BogdanPS
      Basic
      Joined: 12.05.2010 Posts: 27,588
      You should add the villain type and if the situation is HU or multiway to the notes because a lot of what we do (most actually) is villain dependent (and the information we had at the time).

      For the 97 hand we only have 4 outs ( 2 9x, 2 7x)

      Some players, like fishy guys may raise overpairs there (like TT/JJ) or worse 2p (87) but that still makes our hand pretty weak versus a raise.


      The shove vs short/midstack with TT/JJ is also player/position dependent.

      For example BvB or BTN vs BB it's a different story.


      My recommendation: don't try to look at a specific way to play a hand in a specific scenario. Why? Because there are so many permutations of scenarios that we almost never get into the same scenario twice. So you should rather try to understand the logic behind a play and see why, given the information we have, it makes sense what we say (remember that you don't have to always agree with what we post).

      So for example, look at the 97 or JJ hands and say: given this information this makes sense because of ...

      Rather than generalize and say that "shove vs short/midstack w/ TT, JJ even in our best case scenario won’t be super profitable" because that's actually not true. There are many scenarios (as shown above) where this move can be profitable.


      As far as the things to improve go:

      2) this is also very general, you want to be more specific here as well. Against some people it may not be as profitable as checking back (but that's rare).
      3) always look to be the one valuebetting without information unless of course villain doesn't have a lot that can call but may have a lot to bluff with. So even without information you can do that.


      Hope this helps,

      Best regards,

      Bogdan
    • ilidek
      ilidek
      Bronze
      Joined: 06.07.2010 Posts: 2,952
      Hope this helps

      Of course it helps a lot! Thank you very much. I’ve putted here my notes because I may not understand few ideas when you evaluate my hands. When I write why something is profitable or it isn’t it easier to spot mistakes in my thought process.
      PS I’ve never seen coach on micros who evaluate as good as you in both Polish and English community. You not only write something about how someone play hand but you also write some side notes and it’s really helpful

      The shove vs short/midstack with TT/JJ is also player/position dependent.

      Position dependent means from CO+ I can push wider. Vs normal stack QQ+, AK vs shorts / mid also TT+ ? Yeah I know in some cases it’s stupid idea vs guy who has 6/6 after 4k hands I won’t be happy with 3b/c w/ QQ / AK because in best case scenario I am flipping.

      Don’t worry I don’t agree with everything :) You’ve wrote in one hand evaluation that I should bet T IP w/ set when third suited card come on T because I can gain value from two pairs and worse sets. I’ve tried this but it won’t work well on me. I’ve got raise once and gave up hand, after that I decided to not use this gameplan, because I don’t understand the whole process why I should play like this. I just play xb and c or b river because I believe that set has only two streets of value in most cases when FD is on. And I think more likely guy will call me on R when I play xb because he usually think I don’t have flush.

      Thanks for great advices next time I’ll be more specific with my conculsion :)
    • BogdanPS
      BogdanPS
      Basic
      Joined: 12.05.2010 Posts: 27,588
      Hi,

      I think that not betting your set when the flush hits is a huge mistake.

      Lets take two boards as an example:

      We have 66 in both scenarios

      J64 hh, turn is a 2 h - why can we not bet again for pure value? Villain still has 6x, 77-TT, Jx and even some naked Ah. By checking you lose a ton of value.

      If instead of the 2h we have Kh then we may have an argument for checking back because now that's a double scare card and maybe pairs don't call again.

      Remember that a range is made up of MORE than just draws and you are just RESULTS ORIENTED which is terrible in the long term. You tried it once and it failed and now you think it fails every time? What if it worked? You would try it every time?
    • ilidek
      ilidek
      Bronze
      Joined: 06.07.2010 Posts: 2,952
      Hm ok so he can have:
      8 combos of Ax's
      3+3 combo of JJ / 44
      2+4 - 2 combos of 6x and 4 combos of Jx (A,K,Q,T)
      2 combos of Ahx
      6x4 combos of 77-TT

      it's equal 46 combos so 8 / 8+46 = ~15%
      there are:
      12 cards that can scary him away ( A,K,Q),
      8h cards

      so it's 20 / 46 = ~45%

      Hmmm now it looks more clear for me. I think I get what you meant. I've never thought about count how many cards may scare him away but now it seems pretty logical.
    • BogdanPS
      BogdanPS
      Basic
      Joined: 12.05.2010 Posts: 27,588
      Originally posted by ilidek
      Hm ok so he can have:
      8 combos of Ax's
      3+3 combo of JJ / 44
      2+4 - 2 combos of 6x and 4 combos of Jx (A,K,Q,T)
      2 combos of Ahx
      6x4 combos of 77-TT

      it's equal 46 combos so 8 / 8+46 = ~15%
      there are:
      12 cards that can scary him away ( A,K,Q),
      8h cards

      so it's 20 / 46 = ~45%

      Hmmm now it looks more clear for me. I think I get what you meant. I've never thought about count how many cards may scare him away but now it seems pretty logical.
      Glad you are able to see the light :)

      You can also use equilab to see the distribution of someones range on certain cards.

      So you can see how a villains range improves on a specific card.