[NL20-NL50] 55 3bet

    • mlatasrb
      mlatasrb
      Gold
      Joined: 01.04.2012 Posts: 2,720
      iPoker - $0.20 NL FAST (6 max) - Holdem - 5 players
      Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

      SB: 149 BB
      BB: 148.95 BB
      UTG: 211.65 BB
      Hero (CO): 378 BB
      BTN: 108.1 BB

      SB posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

      Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has 5:spade: 5:diamond:

      fold, Hero raises to 3 BB, BTN raises to 9 BB, fold, fold, Hero calls 6 BB

      Flop: (19.5 BB, 2 players) T:club: 5:club: 8:heart:
      Hero checks, BTN bets 12 BB, Hero calls 12 BB

      Turn: (43.5 BB, 2 players) J:club:
      Hero checks, BTN bets 25 BB, Hero raises to 357 BB and is all-in, BTN calls 62.1 BB

      River: (217.7 BB, 2 players) 5:heart:

      Hero shows 5:spade: 5:diamond: (Four of a Kind, Fives) (Pre 19%, Flop 86%, Turn 70%)
      BTN shows Q:club: Q:spade: (Two Pair, Queens and Fives) (Pre 81%, Flop 14%, Turn 30%)
      Hero wins 206.85 BB


      BU 2.1 k hands, 3bet 9, from vs CO 8, cbet flop in 3bet pot 91% (20/22), turn 67%, river 1/1


      I am not sure If call preflop is fine. Usually I fold against someone who 3bets wide with 55, but because he barrels so much, I thought I can play it profitable. I need to pay 6 BB to see flop. Here rule call20 almost applies, but do I really need us to have 20*6bb stacks in 3bet pots? I guess call15 would be enough?
      Also my other concern is, I fold around 85% to 3bet. I don't 4bet as bluff because most of people call or shove so I see it is not profitable. So If I fold so much, people who have stats can exploit me by 3betting? I usually 3bet with any suited cards people who fold so much.
      I dont like calling OOP with hands like AJ, KQ etc. So in order to make this percentage fold to 3bet lower, I think it is better to call with PP, and fold if not hit, because I can stack often with PP.
  • 3 replies
    • EmanuelC16
      EmanuelC16
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.01.2010 Posts: 13,897
      Heya,

      Your preflop call is bad imo. You will call pre, fold flop too often. You lose less by folding to the 3bet in many many cases because you lose the 3bb. If you call and fold post you lose 9bb every time plus you don't really 'defend' vs 3bets, you just play your hand a bit more. How do you force mistakes from your opponent if you call to hit and you only play back when you hit while folding all the other times?

      If you want to not call 3bets OOP, start 4betting. Start by 4betting and if that doesn't work, you have to learn to call 3bets OOP vs wide 3bettors as well. That's why some win more than others and why others actually lose. If you are not skilled enough to make a play yet you have to learn to do it.

      You forget to account for all the air in your opponents ranges.. you have implied odds vs people that flop second best hands but wide ranges don't flop the nuts that often, nor do they flop strong hands. They flop mediocre hands and it just so happens they are very good to play against small pairs like 55.
    • mlatasrb
      mlatasrb
      Gold
      Joined: 01.04.2012 Posts: 2,720
      Originally posted by EmanuelC16
      Heya,

      Your preflop call is bad imo. You will call pre, fold flop too often. You lose less by folding to the 3bet in many many cases because you lose the 3bb. If you call and fold post you lose 9bb every time plus you don't really 'defend' vs 3bets, you just play your hand a bit more. How do you force mistakes from your opponent if you call to hit and you only play back when you hit while folding all the other times?

      If you want to not call 3bets OOP, start 4betting. Start by 4betting and if that doesn't work, you have to learn to call 3bets OOP vs wide 3bettors as well. That's why some win more than others and why others actually lose. If you are not skilled enough to make a play yet you have to learn to do it.

      You forget to account for all the air in your opponents ranges.. you have implied odds vs people that flop second best hands but wide ranges don't flop the nuts that often, nor do they flop strong hands. They flop mediocre hands and it just so happens they are very good to play against small pairs like 55.

      55 I fold postflop, but 88+ I am calling if there is no Q, K, A card on flop.
      Sometimes I call QQ+ OOP if villian is folding to 4bet too often, and barrels a lot, or plays spewy postflop, so I think he can't really know what I have so easlily.
      What hands would you call OOP, against someone who 3bets a lot and doesnt fold to 4bet?
    • EmanuelC16
      EmanuelC16
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.01.2010 Posts: 13,897
      Against someone that doesn't fold to 4bets you can 4bet for thinner value hands like JJ, TT to start with. Then if he calls you can add high broadways and probably down to medium suited connectors depending on how wide he 3bets and calls.

      If he 5bets a lot, I would add JJ to start off to my stacking off range, then TT and also start flatting hands like KQ, AQ, KJs, AJs. It depends a lot on how much each oppponent actually 3bets and where you can win the money postflop. Hands like 88-JJ are decent to call with as well if they are too weak to 4bet. I only really dislike the small pairs which are absolutely fit/fold situations.