Theoretical. Turn missed draw decision.

    • collinz12
      collinz12
      Bronze
      Joined: 08.07.2012 Posts: 9
      1st. What do you think about problems that could occur that would require counterbalancing ranges if one were to bet on the larger side on the turn with draws (missed draw on turn)?
      2nd. Below what size effective stack would you advise against doing so?

      What I mean by large is close to pot. I think it forces other draws to fold, makes hand look like protection (not draw), easy fold to raise, allows protection on the turn, and allows protection bets to occur.
  • 3 replies
    • Asaban
      Asaban
      Moderator
      Moderator
      Joined: 22.09.2006 Posts: 8,234
      Main problem is, that there is no need for any balancing in most cases. There are very few players where you may get a bigger sample size. In most cases your opponents will have a maximum of 100 hands from you and there is no way to build up reads on such a small sample size.

      Therefore there is no need to counter balance.

      Still, I think that playing draws aggressive on the turn is a valid approach. You will take the pot more often then not and will have decent equity if you are called.

      In the end it depends on your general game plan and personal choice.

      Regards,
      Asaban
    • YohanN7
      YohanN7
      Bronze
      Joined: 15.06.2009 Posts: 4,084
      @OP

      Do you mean something like this:

      Full Tilt - |15/30 NL - Holdem - 8 players
      Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

      BTN: 2,160
      Hero (SB): 1,395
      BB: 2,865
      UTG: 1,455
      UTG+1: 1,455
      MP: 1,455
      MP+1: 1,455
      CO: 4,230

      Hero posts SB 15, BB posts BB 30

      Pre Flop: (pot: 45) Hero has 5:diamond: 9:diamond:

      fold, fold, fold, fold, CO calls 30, BTN calls 30, Hero calls 15, BB checks

      Flop: (120, 4 players) A:heart: 3:diamond: 7:diamond:
      Hero bets 60, BB calls 60, fold, BTN calls 60

      Turn: (300, 3 players) 2:heart:
      Hero bets 270, ...
      fold, fold

      Hero wins 300


      Flop: Bet small for a cheap draw + possibility to get my stack in if I hit (which is hard if it goes check-check-check).

      Turn: I had no balancing whatsoever in mind, but it was clear I was representing a made hand, and a fold to an all in seemed clear too.

      It's hard to see what you mean by "..., allows protection on the turn, and allows protection bets to occur." Do you mean the board texture?

      /Johan = :f_confused:
    • Asaban
      Asaban
      Moderator
      Moderator
      Joined: 22.09.2006 Posts: 8,234
      Since you already posted the hand:

      I would prefer a check/raise on the turn rather then a second barrel. This way you can broke your hand against your opponent while at the same time representing a good made hand and getting other draws out of the way. Furthermore there is a possibility of a free river card. If you get called you will have a solid equity in most cases.

      Bet/folding is not what you want to do when holding a draw.

      I would fold the hand preflop btw. The odds don't help much if your hand is that bad ;)

      Regards,
      Asaban