Hand Judging reminder.

    • Ribbo
      Ribbo
      Bronze
      Joined: 25.06.2010 Posts: 6,157
      The forums are there for discussion, just because I reply doesn't mean it closes the thread. :f_biggrin:

      I will let you in to a little secret about how things are being done right now on PokerStrategy. Videos and articles are released for the content that is getting talked about. So if you want more PLO content, you actually have to be seen to be active in the community. If you don't talk about something, how can anyone know that it's popular?

      So for the next 30 days, let's see how many people *actually* want to talk about Omaha, in other words, less lurking! :f_cool:
  • 15 replies
    • patszerdonk
      patszerdonk
      Bronze
      Joined: 19.05.2011 Posts: 834
      Let's talk about rake.
      I won't playing PLO anymore.
    • Skodljivec
      Skodljivec
      Bronze
      Joined: 17.12.2011 Posts: 5,709
      That has to be the lamest most overused excuse ever
    • VorpalF2F
      VorpalF2F
      Super Moderator
      Super Moderator
      Joined: 02.09.2010 Posts: 8,908
      Originally posted by patszerdonk
      Let's talk about rake.
      I won't playing PLO anymore.
      If you're talking about Omaha H/L then the rake in proportion to what you win is large.

      However the good thing is that you lose a lot less, and in H/L games, if you have a great lo hand, it is easy to entice others in to the pot.

      What REALLY sux, though is when you split the low (or high), but it's still better than losing totally.

      I've been playing the Omaha freerolls on stars, and I'm getting more and more intrigued by the game.

      --VS
    • patszerdonk
      patszerdonk
      Bronze
      Joined: 19.05.2011 Posts: 834
      Just look at blog section here or 2p2.com . Almost all PLO's blog (micro limit) died after a few post. Why? because they are not winning.

      Ofcourse we still can winning at PLO despite of crazy rake. My point was playing PLO is less profitable if we compare it with other games. If we put the some effort/time for playing and learning, NLHE is clearly more profitable. I'm talking about PLO 25 and below. Don't know about others limit or sub game like PLO H/L
    • Kyyberi
      Kyyberi
      Coach
      Coach
      Joined: 09.07.2010 Posts: 10,510
      What I have heard is that micro NLHE is rocky environment and it's hard to win there. In PLO there is definitely value even in micros, but the fact is that rakeback is going to be a big portion of your income.

      I guess that the reason why so many blogs died after few posts is the lack of interest. Did you check you how many blogs have died in similar way at NLHE section? And it might be that they find out that you actually need to learn PLO before you can make money out of it, so if they expected an easy money with just clicking some buttons they just got tired.
    • metza
      metza
      Bronze
      Joined: 28.01.2012 Posts: 2,220
      I have played only a couple thousand hands of PLO back in 2012 but it did seem like the fishiness is much higher than in hold'em so I don't see why it wouldn't be profitable.

      One question I have for you PLO guys is after you've been playing it for so long can you instantly tell what hand someone has at showdown eg you just look at your opponents hand like:

      J :club: K :spade: 7 :spade: T :diamond:

      on

      K :club: 8 :spade: Q :spade: 5 :diamond: 9 :heart:

      and just be like "oh he's got the straight" in a split second?

      When I was railing Isildur vs Bttech I'd see the money go one way and be like "huh.......?.......oh ok." Forget figuring out your equity is, must be a total headache at first
    • Backcushion
      Backcushion
      Bronze
      Joined: 29.12.2007 Posts: 816
      Originally posted by metza
      I have played only a couple thousand hands of PLO back in 2012 but it did seem like the fishiness is much higher than in hold'em so I don't see why it wouldn't be profitable.

      One question I have for you PLO guys is after you've been playing it for so long can you instantly tell what hand someone has at showdown eg you just look at your opponents hand like:

      J :club: K :spade: 7 :spade: T :diamond:

      on

      K :club: 8 :spade: Q :spade: 5 :diamond: 9 :heart:

      and just be like "oh he's got the straight" in a split second?

      When I was railing Isildur vs Bttech I'd see the money go one way and be like "huh.......?.......oh ok." Forget figuring out your equity is, must be a total headache at first
      You'll get used to it, the more you play.
    • Skodljivec
      Skodljivec
      Bronze
      Joined: 17.12.2011 Posts: 5,709
      Originally posted by metza
      I have played only a couple thousand hands of PLO back in 2012 but it did seem like the fishiness is much higher than in hold'em so I don't see why it wouldn't be profitable.

      One question I have for you PLO guys is after you've been playing it for so long can you instantly tell what hand someone has at showdown eg you just look at your opponents hand like:

      J :club: K :spade: 7 :spade: T :diamond:

      on

      K :club: 8 :spade: Q :spade: 5 :diamond: 9 :heart:

      and just be like "oh he's got the straight" in a split second?

      When I was railing Isildur vs Bttech I'd see the money go one way and be like "huh.......?.......oh ok." Forget figuring out your equity is, must be a total headache at first
      haha :D I remember when i started playin... I could only wait to see where the chips would move :) But after a while it gets automatic. You immeadiatly know which cards help you and which help your opponent... It was hard the first week for sure tough :D
    • mattusko
      mattusko
      Bronze
      Joined: 06.02.2010 Posts: 765
      Hi all,

      I started to play omaha few days ago (20:D ), because i was tired from playing 9man SNG, it wasnt fun for me anymore. So far i played 11K hands at PLO10 and i like this game very much :)

      1.You are all talking about rakeback, but i can't imagine to play somewhere esle, because i play on PS.
      Is it so bad at PS for micro PLO? (plo10 and higher)

      2.When i decided where to start my blog, i chose CZ/SVK plo komunity even if it looks like i am only one who post hands to HJ forum :D Meybe it was wrong move, i can improove my english skills, if nothing else. Who knows.

      3.When i look into HJ forum, all hands are flo PLOzoom50 etc and i dont feel so skilled to put any comment, after i red Judge comments :D

      regards,
      Mattusko
    • Skodljivec
      Skodljivec
      Bronze
      Joined: 17.12.2011 Posts: 5,709
      Hey mattusko :)

      1. Well i believe PS has the most upside, even if rb is bad. The reason is there is a very large field, and imo it's very soft at the micros. Also, the rakeback is small, however so is the rake in the first place. I traveled around in my plo play, but came back to PS, and i haven't looked back.

      2. Repost the blog here as well, why not? :D work on your translation skills as you go.

      3. I suggest you post your own hands then; explain your thought process, and let the more experienced guys help you :)
    • Tim64
      Tim64
      Black
      Joined: 02.11.2008 Posts: 7,401
      Well, I for one am posting lots of donkey plays to discuss so I'm doing my bit, boss :)
    • Vaars
      Vaars
      Bronze
      Joined: 02.09.2012 Posts: 40
      I won my first ever PLO SNG last week without even knowing how to play it! (I clicked on it by accident and realised too late that it wasn't NLHE!)
    • provoman
      provoman
      Bronze
      Joined: 22.06.2010 Posts: 158
      daTy4to(UTG) $1.34 - VP:50 PFR:0 AF:0.7 W:33|0 STL:0| 3B:0|0 CB:| 50 N:-2 Hands:12
      Georgi4272(MP) $1.45 - VP:36 PFR:7 AF:Inf. W:33|0 STL:0| 3B:14|0 CB: N:-1.96 Hands:14
      lokoboy1(CO) $6.50 - VP:79 PFR:57 AF:2.0 W:27|67 STL:100| 3B:40| CB:67|50 N:-2.50 Hands:14
      TNJ2011(BTN) $8.06 - VP:79 PFR:29 AF:3.0 W:0| STL: 3B:0|0 CB:67|100 N:0.06 Hands:14
      Me(SB) $5.12 - VP:46 PFR:17 AF:1.5 W:36|54 STL:26|36 3B:12|11 CB:38|47 N:-16.51 Hands:827
      AlexandraLarisa(BB) $3.31 - VP:0 PFR:0 AF:0 W:0| STL: 3B:0| CB: N:-0.20 Hands:2


      Pre Flop: Me(SB) with [2d,4d,2s,6c]
      daTy4to(UTG) calls 0.05, Georgi4272(MP) raises 0.10, lokoboy1(CO) raises 0.42, TNJ2011(BTN) calls 0.42, Me(SB) calls 0.40, AlexandraLarisa(BB) folds, daTy4to(UTG) calls 0.37, Georgi4272(MP) raises 1.35, lokoboy1(CO) raises 5.24, TNJ2011(BTN) folds, Me(SB) calls 4.70, daTy4to(UTG) calls 0.92


      Flop: (T :spade: ,7 :heart: ,8 :club:)

      what man can do after tilt!

      Ofcourse 2 come and I win here:s_evil:
      Turn: (2 :club:)



      River: (J :diamond:)



      Final:
      lokoboy1(CO) shows [Qh,8s,Th,Ks]
      Me(SB) shows [2 :diamond: ,4 :diamond: ,2 :spade: ,6 :club:]
      daTy4to(UTG) shows [4s,4 :club: ,A :club: ,K :club:]
      Georgi4272(MP) shows [Ah,As,7s,Qs]
      Returns 0.54 to lokoboy1(CO)
      Me(SB) wins 6.97
      Me(SB) wins 0.32
      Me(SB) wins 5.54

      .
      .
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      .
      ..
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      .
      .
      Here is answer:
      [table]'http://propokertools.com/simulations/show?g=oh&s=Generic&h1=AhAs7sQs&h2=4s4cAcKc&h3=Qh8sThKs&h4=2d4d2s6c'
      [/table]
      [table=head]Player | Equity | Wins Hi | Ties Hi
      2d4d2s6c | 33,5835% | 33,5835% | 0,0000%
      Qh8sThKs | 30,1394% | 30,0616% | 0,1573%
      4s4cAcKc | 14,2579% | 14,1239% | 0,2698%
      AhAs7sQs | 22,0193% | 21,8822% | 0,2761%
      [/table]


      fast I calculate in my brain that I have around 30% to win here vs all broduey card whitch kill eatch other!

      Expect to take some leason form this how important is posision and reads of opponnet.
    • Aronyau
      Aronyau
      Bronze
      Joined: 09.07.2012 Posts: 77
      Originally posted by provoman
      daTy4to(UTG) $1.34 - VP:50 PFR:0 AF:0.7 W:33|0 STL:0| 3B:0|0 CB:| 50 N:-2 Hands:12
      Georgi4272(MP) $1.45 - VP:36 PFR:7 AF:Inf. W:33|0 STL:0| 3B:14|0 CB: N:-1.96 Hands:14
      lokoboy1(CO) $6.50 - VP:79 PFR:57 AF:2.0 W:27|67 STL:100| 3B:40| CB:67|50 N:-2.50 Hands:14
      TNJ2011(BTN) $8.06 - VP:79 PFR:29 AF:3.0 W:0| STL: 3B:0|0 CB:67|100 N:0.06 Hands:14
      Me(SB) $5.12 - VP:46 PFR:17 AF:1.5 W:36|54 STL:26|36 3B:12|11 CB:38|47 N:-16.51 Hands:827
      AlexandraLarisa(BB) $3.31 - VP:0 PFR:0 AF:0 W:0| STL: 3B:0| CB: N:-0.20 Hands:2


      Pre Flop: Me(SB) with [2d,4d,2s,6c]
      daTy4to(UTG) calls 0.05, Georgi4272(MP) raises 0.10, lokoboy1(CO) raises 0.42, TNJ2011(BTN) calls 0.42, Me(SB) calls 0.40, AlexandraLarisa(BB) folds, daTy4to(UTG) calls 0.37, Georgi4272(MP) raises 1.35, lokoboy1(CO) raises 5.24, TNJ2011(BTN) folds, Me(SB) calls 4.70, daTy4to(UTG) calls 0.92


      Flop: (T :spade: ,7 :heart: ,8 :club:)

      what man can do after tilt!

      Ofcourse 2 come and I win here:s_evil:
      Turn: (2 :club:)



      River: (J :diamond:)



      Final:
      lokoboy1(CO) shows [Qh,8s,Th,Ks]
      Me(SB) shows [2 :diamond: ,4 :diamond: ,2 :spade: ,6 :club:]
      daTy4to(UTG) shows [4s,4 :club: ,A :club: ,K :club:]
      Georgi4272(MP) shows [Ah,As,7s,Qs]
      Returns 0.54 to lokoboy1(CO)
      Me(SB) wins 6.97
      Me(SB) wins 0.32
      Me(SB) wins 5.54

      .
      .
      .
      .
      ..
      .
      .
      .
      .
      .
      .
      .
      Here is answer:
      [table]'http://propokertools.com/simulations/show?g=oh&s=Generic&h1=AhAs7sQs&h2=4s4cAcKc&h3=Qh8sThKs&h4=2d4d2s6c'
      [/table]
      [table=head]Player | Equity | Wins Hi | Ties Hi
      2d4d2s6c | 33,5835% | 33,5835% | 0,0000%
      Qh8sThKs | 30,1394% | 30,0616% | 0,1573%
      4s4cAcKc | 14,2579% | 14,1239% | 0,2698%
      AhAs7sQs | 22,0193% | 21,8822% | 0,2761%
      [/table]


      fast I calculate in my brain that I have around 30% to win here vs all broduey card whitch kill eatch other!

      Expect to take some leason form this how important is posision and reads of opponnet.
      8/10
    • provoman
      provoman
      Bronze
      Joined: 22.06.2010 Posts: 158
      Becouse I am good player with less time I use my skill to late reg. I give to oponent 2 h ahead on PLO 3.3$ and put 2 multi reg.

      With One I play on final.
      Here is my last epic hand.
      All opponent are very good player.

      Here is the hand:

      ReraiseKK(MP) $89858 - VP:17 PFR:6 AF:1.7 W:20|50 STL:33| 3B:0|0 CB:67| N:10336 Hands:47
      acvo(CO) $92304 - VP:37 PFR:4 AF:7.0 W:28|63 STL:33|67 3B:0|100 CB:0| N:83644 Hands:73
      japingaa(BTN) $72996 - VP:30 PFR:8 AF:3.2 W:39|64 STL:8|40 3B:19| CB:75|67 N:57496 Hands:83
      Me(SB) $51080 - VP:22 PFR:8 AF:1.9 W:33|61 STL:19|79 3B:4|20 CB:47|73 N:86355 Hands:468
      TOURNYKING(BB) $118401 - VP:58 PFR:15 AF:0.6 W:20|67 STL:14|0 3B:6|0 CB:0|80 N:29515 Hands:55
      angrypoisson(UTG) $34361 - VP:27 PFR:13 AF:2.0 W:30|43 STL:25|83 3B:4|50 CB:43|20 N:-57405 Hands:79


      Pre Flop: Me(SB) with [6 :diamond: ,6 :club: ,K :spade: ,Q :spade:]
      angrypoisson(UTG) folds, ReraiseKK(MP) folds, acvo(CO) folds, japingaa(BTN) calls 2000, Me(SB) calls 1000, TOURNYKING(BB) checks


      Flop: (2 :heart: ,6 :spade: ,K :club:) (3 players)
      Me(SB) checks, TOURNYKING(BB) checks, japingaa(BTN) bets 4000, Me(SB) raises 16000, TOURNYKING(BB) folds, japingaa(BTN) calls 12000


      Turn: 7 :club: (2 players)
      Me(SB) bets 29000, japingaa(BTN) raises 54996, Me(SB) calls 4080


      River: (3 :club:)



      Final:
      japingaa(BTN) shows [K :diamond: ,2 :club: ,A :club: ,2 :diamond:]
      Me(SB) shows [6 :diamond: ,6 :club: ,K :spade: ,Q :spade:]
      Returns 21916 to japingaa(BTN)
      japingaa(BTN) wins 104160


      This night I think a lot and decide that I must only pay on flop, pay c-bet (valu-bet) oj turn and fold on river.
      I will stay in tournamet and have chance to go upper play - Am I right.

      Wait for some expert to answer me is tournament live more valuable or my play is good. Txs

      ----------------------------
      on flop:
      [table]'http://propokertools.com/simulations/show?g=oh&s=Generic&h1=Kd2cAc2d&h2=6d6cKsQs&b=2h6sKc'
      board: 2:heart: 6:spade: K:club:
      [/table]
      [table=head]Player | Equity | Wins Hi | Ties Hi
      6d6cKsQs | 90,1220% | 90,1220% | 0,0000%
      Kd2cAc2d | 9,8780% | 9,8780% | 0,0000%
      [/table]


      on turn:
      [table]'http://propokertools.com/simulations/show?g=oh&s=Generic&h1=Kd2cAc2d&h2=6d6cKsQs&b=2h6sKc7c'
      board: 2:heart: 6:spade: K:club: 7:club:
      [/table]
      [table=head]Player | Equity | Wins Hi | Ties Hi
      6d6cKsQs | 77,5000% | 77,5000% | 0,0000%
      Kd2cAc2d | 22,5000% | 22,5000% | 0,0000%
      [/table]