[NL20-NL50] nl20 sh TT

    • DrDunne
      DrDunne
      Bronze
      Joined: 29.12.2010 Posts: 3,378
      $0.20 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
      Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

      BB: $27.95
      UTG: $22.86 (VPIP: 17.46, PFR: 15.87, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 65)
      Hero (MP): $19.40
      CO: $9.94 (VPIP: 28.92, PFR: 20.48, 3Bet Preflop: 5.00, Hands: 86)
      BTN: $11.36 (VPIP: 16.67, PFR: 8.33, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 12)
      SB: $20.00 (VPIP: 29.29, PFR: 25.71, 3Bet Preflop: 7.02, Hands: 144)

      SB posts SB $0.10, BB posts BB $0.20

      Pre Flop: (pot: $0.30) Hero has T:club: T:heart:

      fold, Hero raises to $0.60, fold, fold, fold, BB calls $0.40

      Flop: ($1.30, 2 players) 7:heart: 7:spade: A:club:
      BB checks, Hero checks

      Turn: ($1.30, 2 players) 9:heart:
      BB bets $0.65, Hero calls $0.65

      River: ($2.60, 2 players) 6:heart:
      BB bets $1.30, Hero...

      i have no information on villain.

      flop i dont really think i can cbet because he'll probably fold out worse and continue with better.

      on the turn he stabs which i think is expected and he probably has air, turned FDs, Ax or some nutted hands like 77 or 99. he can also be turning small PPs into a bluff like 22-66. i think i can still call the turn...

      on the river i dont really know what to do... on the 1 hand, his sizing and his line indicate something for value, but at the same time i called on the turn because i was bluffcatching and the river only completed a BDF and so should i have planned a river call from the turn? so i call the turn as a bluffcatch and therefore i should call this river because it's a bit of a blank?
  • 5 replies
    • mbml
      mbml
      Black
      Joined: 27.11.2008 Posts: 20,717
      Hi

      Flop: With JJ-KK It's a check, with TT or worse I would just bet. I don't think the check is all that bad but TT is close.

      River: Easy fold as played. We don't know how often he's bluffing here so without reads, we fold the weakest hands in our range (I'm assuming TT is your worst bluff catcher here). Especially when some draws hit (T8s, hearts) ...

      Thanks.
    • DrDunne
      DrDunne
      Bronze
      Joined: 29.12.2010 Posts: 3,378
      hey mbml

      could you explain a little bit why JJ is a check back and TT is a cbet? what makes it close, is it because with TT it is more likely to face an overcard? because the difference doesnt seem that big - with TT we see an overcard 25% of the time but with JJ we face a Q or K only 17% but the difference isnt huge...

      also what is your plan for later streets when you do cbet with TT here? my default here is to just check back with like 99-KK and play the turn/river because its much easier to get to SD if we don't cbet the flop. generally we check back the turn and then we face a bet on the river and have to fold it. but if we check back we can either bet IP on the turn or call a stab quite happy that he'll stab light on average. then we can make our decision on the river.

      and what do you think about the argument that our hand is face up if we check back this flop? my thinking is that we shouldn't really assume an unknown will read hands well so im not too bothered about balancing and i can get value later/get to SD easier with a flop check. if i had info that the guy was not exactly weak then i'd be more inclined to merge my range and bet for value from hands like 99 or OOP floats or whatever.


      about what you said for the river, it makes a lot of sense - TT is my worst bluffcatcher. but im finding it difficult to realise things like this in game. like i cant sit at the table and say "i'm at the top/bottom of my range, therefore i should...." - i would just time out. but i think it's really interesting. how do you think i could work on this part of my game? i'm finding it really difficult to think about my whole range and identify the top and bottom of it.
    • mbml
      mbml
      Black
      Joined: 27.11.2008 Posts: 20,717
      well there needs to be a cutoff somewhere right? With the same argument, I could say that the difference between 99 and TT is very small and thus we should check both and it goes on and on...

      If you bet you are mostly betting to take the pot down and you probably have to fold later on but the overcards issue is certainly one which makes playability with TT/99 much poorer than JJ-KK.
    • DrDunne
      DrDunne
      Bronze
      Joined: 29.12.2010 Posts: 3,378
      i see what you mean. i do have trouble figuring out where the cut off should be and i guess this is one of those spots. at the time i was thinking TT is an easy check back but 99 would be the cut off where im not 100% sure if i should just bet to take the pot down and turn it into a bluff or check back..

      if you bet this flop with the TT, what is your plan on the turn then? i mean when we "bet to take it down" does this imply a 1-and-done? the board has no real scarecards for me to continue my aggression on and it's not like i have a 5 out-draw to justify a 2nd barrel...
    • mbml
      mbml
      Black
      Joined: 27.11.2008 Posts: 20,717
      yea i'll make one bet and give up. this is not a good hand to barrel and i would only consider calling river if villain is notorious for floating really wide with backdoors (but still vs such an opponent you probably shouldn't bet flop)