giving yourself odds to call with a flushdraw

    • Semesa
      Semesa
      Bronze
      Joined: 03.06.2008 Posts: 294
      would this be a good idea?

      say, flop comes A x x, with 2 clubs.
      you have KcXc. you know villain will probably try to bet you off the flushdraw by not giving you decent odds to continue.

      would it be a good idea to bet say... 1/3 pot sized, so that with a raise you would still have odds to call?
  • 4 replies
    • Grimzor
      Grimzor
      Bronze
      Joined: 28.03.2008 Posts: 421
      lol, wat? Seriously... what are you speaking about there? :D

      If you know opponent will raise you then dont bet with draw. It will cost you more $ to see next card and if he wont want to give you odds, he will make sure you dont get them anyway. And i dont see how can you get right odds after raise unless its like minraise.

      Lets say pot is 9$, you bet 1/3 as suggested so pot is now 12$. If opponent raises 3x your raise then it is 6$ for you to call with 21$ pot. 3.5:1. Not good enough but might call if you get implied odds. But who said opponent has to bet 3x your bet? What if you bet your 3$ and i think you bet that to stop me from betting because you want to see next card as cheap as possible and i put you on draw. I raise to pot size and you have to call 9$ in 24$ pot.

      And also, even if you get the odds after raise it is still bad move imo. You paid money with your bet too. Its your money you know :D Your small bet wont make any reasonable hand to fold and will just make pot bigger. That doesnt sound like thing you want to get with your draw unless its monsterdraw and then you want money in asap.

      Dont think there is a move how you can artificially make yourself good odds that would be profitable. With your logic we could better bet amount of effective stacks-1$. So if we both have 10$ and pot is 10$, bet out 9$. Then if i go all in you would have 29:1 odds. Wow! What a great odds.... See the point here? You managed to get 29:1 odds with your draw... Thats so fantastic, IF you forget about 9$ you paid to get it :D
    • Semesa
      Semesa
      Bronze
      Joined: 03.06.2008 Posts: 294
      then why is it a common move to bet with marginal hands in MTT's to give yourself odds to call an all in from a shortstack? isnt this basically the same thing?
    • Grimzor
      Grimzor
      Bronze
      Joined: 28.03.2008 Posts: 421
      Common move? hmm .. never heard of such thing. Can you give me link to some article about such move? Or is it that you just saw other players play like that?
    • rhinoneil
      rhinoneil
      Gold
      Joined: 16.04.2008 Posts: 1,159
      IMO it depends what happened preflop. If I just called with your KcXc I would say that check call or check raise would be the way to go, if I raised pre then I would probably C bet the flop and see what villain does then.